[Script Info]
Title: 
[Events]
Format: Layer, Start, End, Style, Name, MarginL, MarginR, MarginV, Effect, Text
Dialogue: 0,0:00:01.89,0:00:06.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Male Presenter: I think most people here know Larry Lessig. You should know him either
Dialogue: 0,0:00:06.04,0:00:13.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from his work at Stanford or Harvard, Creative Commons, helped out the Electronic Frontier
Dialogue: 0,0:00:13.31,0:00:17.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Foundation, the Sunlight Foundation. There's a whole bunch of places you should know him
Dialogue: 0,0:00:17.26,0:00:17.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:17.73,0:00:21.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But really the reason why we wanna pay attention to what he has to say is because he's been
Dialogue: 0,0:00:21.96,0:00:27.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,right on so many issues, whether arguing in front of the Supreme Court, talking about
Dialogue: 0,0:00:27.22,0:00:32.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,things like copyright extension, or--if people noticed a few years ago--he started to move
Dialogue: 0,0:00:32.55,0:00:36.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,away from copyright and started to talk about broader issues.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:36.04,0:00:42.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Specifically, the influence or potential corruption of money in politics and a lot of institutions
Dialogue: 0,0:00:42.05,0:00:47.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that are important in the United States. So, I think it's important that we make sure that
Dialogue: 0,0:00:47.05,0:00:52.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Larry not be a Cassandra. You know, the prophet who could hear the future, but no one would
Dialogue: 0,0:00:52.96,0:00:54.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,ever believe her.
Dialogue: 0,0:00:54.58,0:00:58.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And so, I think it's important for us to listen to what he's got to say today. Read through
Dialogue: 0,0:00:58.28,0:01:03.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the book. It's really good. Don't forget to badge in. But also, after the talk, please
Dialogue: 0,0:01:03.09,0:01:07.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,take a little while and ask, "How can we try to make sure that he's not a Cassandra--that
Dialogue: 0,0:01:07.98,0:01:09.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,we do take these issues seriously?"
Dialogue: 0,0:01:09.47,0:01:14.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Because, I think, the influence of money in politics and in our institutions is probably
Dialogue: 0,0:01:14.09,0:01:19.36,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the most important issue facing us today in the United States. So with that, thanks very
Dialogue: 0,0:01:19.36,0:01:21.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,much to Larry Lessig.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:21.31,0:01:22.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[applause]
Dialogue: 0,0:01:22.59,0:01:34.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Thank, Matt. And it's great to be back. I have one sacred text. "There
Dialogue: 0,0:01:34.70,0:01:42.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil." Henry David Thoreau, 1846, on Walden.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:42.20,0:01:50.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the roots.
Dialogue: 0,0:01:50.62,0:01:57.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Imagine a letter written by a young woman. "There were two clocks regulating our life--the
Dialogue: 0,0:01:57.32,0:02:05.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,one on the wall and the one in the bottle. We built our life around those clocks. He
Dialogue: 0,0:02:05.22,0:02:07.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,slept late so mornings were bliss.
Dialogue: 0,0:02:07.42,0:02:13.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,“We could play and laugh without fear. But at some point, he would awake. And soon after
Dialogue: 0,0:02:13.14,0:02:19.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,he woke, the bottle was opened. And then the older the day grew, the more terrifying my
Dialogue: 0,0:02:19.39,0:02:24.36,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,life became. He was happy at first--just before dinner, the most happy.
Dialogue: 0,0:02:24.36,0:02:28.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,“That's the only time I spoke to him, a moment to pretend I had a father who had a
Dialogue: 0,0:02:28.29,0:02:33.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,feeling of love. He'd smile. He'd laugh. But then, he'd grow irritated. And by the end
Dialogue: 0,0:02:33.27,0:02:38.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of dinner, he was angry and if we weren't gone--usually just hiding in our room by nine--he'd
Dialogue: 0,0:02:38.90,0:02:42.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,be violent. He hit me more than once.
Dialogue: 0,0:02:42.19,0:02:46.35,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,“Once he tried to do something worse than hitting me and then I left and I never went
Dialogue: 0,0:02:46.35,0:02:54.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,back. We struggled to do many things in that house to keep food in the house, to keep the
Dialogue: 0,0:02:54.66,0:03:02.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,winter out of the house, to keep the house. But the one thing we never even spoke about
Dialogue: 0,0:03:02.44,0:03:04.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,was getting him to stop.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:04.30,0:03:10.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,“I don't know why. The bottle was just part of our life. We learned to live with it. Anything
Dialogue: 0,0:03:10.56,0:03:22.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,more just seemed impossible." Now, the thing about us--we humans--is that we adapt, we
Dialogue: 0,0:03:22.04,0:03:24.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,adjust, we learn to live with it until we can't.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:24.91,0:03:31.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And then a certain fever breaks out and if we're lucky, we have this Thoreauvian moment--a
Dialogue: 0,0:03:31.33,0:03:37.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,recognition that we have to stop hacking at the branches and start striking at the roots,
Dialogue: 0,0:03:37.30,0:03:44.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the recognition that we have to become this sense of a root striker. OK. So, here's the
Dialogue: 0,0:03:44.19,0:03:45.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,argument here.
Dialogue: 0,0:03:45.96,0:03:52.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think that there's this feeling among too many of us Americans that we just might not
Dialogue: 0,0:03:52.38,0:03:57.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,make it. Not that the end is near or that doom is around the corner, but that a distinctly
Dialogue: 0,0:03:57.24,0:04:04.35,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,American feeling of inevitability of greatness, culturally, economically, politically, is
Dialogue: 0,0:04:04.35,0:04:10.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,gone--that we have become Britain or Rome or Greece.
Dialogue: 0,0:04:10.06,0:04:16.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,A generation ago, Ronald Reagan rallied the nation to deny a similar charge: Jimmy Carter's
Dialogue: 0,0:04:16.58,0:04:22.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,fear that we had fallen into a state of malaise. And I confess. I was one of those so rallied
Dialogue: 0,0:04:22.00,0:04:28.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and I still believe Reagan was right today. But the feeling I'm talking about today is
Dialogue: 0,0:04:28.45,0:04:28.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,different.
Dialogue: 0,0:04:28.94,0:04:35.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Not that we, as a people, have lost anything of our potential, but that we, as a Republic,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:35.95,0:04:44.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,have. That our capacity for governing, the one thing that we were once most proud of,
Dialogue: 0,0:04:44.51,0:04:49.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this our Republic, is the one thing that we have all learned to ignore. Government is
Dialogue: 0,0:04:49.51,0:04:52.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,an embarrassment.
Dialogue: 0,0:04:52.33,0:04:57.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And it has lost the capacity to make the most essential decisions and slowly it dawns upon
Dialogue: 0,0:04:57.61,0:05:03.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,us that a ship that cannot be steered is a ship that will sink. This is not a Democratic
Dialogue: 0,0:05:03.96,0:05:10.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or Republican point alone. This is a genuinely multi-partisan frustration.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:10.09,0:05:14.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The sense that the government doesn't work is signaled by many different policy areas
Dialogue: 0,0:05:14.12,0:05:20.50,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,on the left and the right, which systematically get blocked. And when confronted with this
Dialogue: 0,0:05:20.50,0:05:27.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,systematic block, my suggestion is we need to exercise this Thoreauvian insight. So,
Dialogue: 0,0:05:27.53,0:05:31.97,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,my objective this afternoon is to do a little bit of brainwashing.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:31.97,0:05:32.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:05:32.93,0:05:38.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,To get you to the place that you see the roots that I want you to see. I'm gonna do that
Dialogue: 0,0:05:38.44,0:05:42.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with three some examples. One of them is familiar. Indeed, I told a similar story here the last
Dialogue: 0,0:05:42.59,0:05:46.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,time I was here--the story around copyright.
Dialogue: 0,0:05:46.14,0:05:52.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,On October 27th, 1998, I became a copyright activist the day President Clinton signed
Dialogue: 0,0:05:52.28,0:05:59.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,into law a statute in honor of this great American, the Sonny Bono Copyright Term Extension
Dialogue: 0,0:05:59.10,0:06:05.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Act--a statute which extended the term of existing copyrights by 20 years.
Dialogue: 0,0:06:05.31,0:06:09.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Now, the question Congress was supposed to be asking when it passed that statute was,
Dialogue: 0,0:06:09.92,0:06:16.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,"Would it advance the public good to extend the term of an existing copyright by 20 years?"
Dialogue: 0,0:06:16.52,0:06:21.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Copyrights are designed to create incentives, but we know about this universe. Put aside
Dialogue: 0,0:06:21.11,0:06:22.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Star Trek for a moment.
Dialogue: 0,0:06:22.11,0:06:28.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,What we know about this universe is that its incentives are prospective. So, not even the
Dialogue: 0,0:06:28.26,0:06:33.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,United States Congress can get George Gershwin to produce anything more.
Dialogue: 0,0:06:33.57,0:06:34.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:06:34.44,0:06:38.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So when you ask the question, "Does it make sense to advance the public good to extend
Dialogue: 0,0:06:38.03,0:06:41.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the term of existing copyright?" it's a pretty easy answer. Indeed, when we challenged this
Dialogue: 0,0:06:41.69,0:06:46.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,statute in the Supreme Court and a bunch of economists wanted to sign a brief saying it
Dialogue: 0,0:06:46.65,0:06:49.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,did not advance the public good, this liberal, left-wing--.
Dialogue: 0,0:06:49.52,0:06:57.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Oh, I'm sorry. Wait. This is Milton Friedman--right-wing, Nobel Prize winning economist, agreed to sign
Dialogue: 0,0:06:57.09,0:07:01.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the brief but only if the word "no brainer" was in the brief somewhere.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:01.93,0:07:03.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:07:03.18,0:07:08.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So obvious was it that you could not extend the public good by extending the term of existing
Dialogue: 0,0:07:08.49,0:07:15.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,copyrights. But apparently there were no brains in this place when Congress unanimously extended
Dialogue: 0,0:07:15.16,0:07:17.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the term of these existing copyrights.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:17.37,0:07:22.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,What there was, was more than six million dollars in contributions from Disney and related
Dialogue: 0,0:07:22.93,0:07:28.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,corporations seeking the extension of their valuable copyrights--the public be damned.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:28.03,0:07:32.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Here's another example. Wall Street Journal, at the end of last year, was puzzled about
Dialogue: 0,0:07:32.28,0:07:37.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the explosion of temporary tax provisions in our tax code.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:37.43,0:07:41.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,These temporary tax provisions expire after a limited period of time. And that leads to
Dialogue: 0,0:07:41.44,0:07:48.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this extender mania, as lobbyists and Congress race around to try to extend the particular
Dialogue: 0,0:07:48.11,0:07:53.72,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,tax provision for another period of time. And the Journal wondered what explains the
Dialogue: 0,0:07:53.72,0:07:57.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,explosion and change in the number of these extensions.
Dialogue: 0,0:07:57.73,0:08:04.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Well, it turns out the first of these temporary provisions was given to us by Reagan in 1981.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:04.78,0:08:09.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Congress passed the Research and Development Tax Credit. But because the Democrats were
Dialogue: 0,0:08:09.29,0:08:13.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,skeptical about whether it would work, they made the tax credit temporary.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:13.48,0:08:16.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They said they would test it after a number of years. And if it turned out it worked,
Dialogue: 0,0:08:16.98,0:08:20.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they would make it permanent. If it didn't work, they would repeal it. So, after a couple
Dialogue: 0,0:08:20.99,0:08:24.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,years, the economists asked the question, "Did it work?" The answer is yes. Left and
Dialogue: 0,0:08:24.64,0:08:28.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,right economists all agreed that it did work. It was a great tax idea.
Dialogue: 0,0:08:28.94,0:08:32.72,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It spurred a kind of investment that otherwise would not have been spurred. And so, it made
Dialogue: 0,0:08:32.72,0:08:38.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,sense absolutely to make this part of the tax code. Here's the puzzle. It is still temporary
Dialogue: 0,0:08:38.61,0:08:40.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to this day. Why?
Dialogue: 0,0:08:40.67,0:08:45.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Well, as Rebecca Kysar describes in this piece in the Georgia Law Review, "The principle
Dialogue: 0,0:08:45.66,0:08:51.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,recipients of the research credit are large US manufacturing corporations. These business
Dialogue: 0,0:08:51.24,0:08:56.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,entities are more than willing to invest in lobbying activities and campaign donations
Dialogue: 0,0:08:56.32,0:09:00.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to ensure the continuance of this large tax savings."
Dialogue: 0,0:09:00.96,0:09:04.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The Institute for Policy Innovation put it a little bit more sharply. "This cycle has
Dialogue: 0,0:09:04.88,0:09:09.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,repeated for years. Congress allows the credit to lapse until another short extension is
Dialogue: 0,0:09:09.56,0:09:14.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,given. Proceeded, of course, by a series of fundraisers and speeches about the importance
Dialogue: 0,0:09:14.06,0:09:16.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of nurturing innovation.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:16.02,0:09:21.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Congress essentially uses the cycle to raise money for re-election, promising industry
Dialogue: 0,0:09:21.60,0:09:28.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,more predictability the next time around." Now this dynamic is central to how Washington
Dialogue: 0,0:09:28.75,0:09:36.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,works. We architect tax policy in part, at least, not just to raise money for our treasury,
Dialogue: 0,0:09:36.82,0:09:42.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,but to make it easier to raise money for our Congressmen's campaigns.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:42.46,0:09:47.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And not just tax policy. When Al Gore was Vice President, he had an idea to simplify
Dialogue: 0,0:09:47.66,0:09:53.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the regulation governing infrastructure that internet would come across. Right now, we
Dialogue: 0,0:09:53.73,0:09:59.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,have two titles in the Communications Act--Title Two and Title Six. Title Two governs telephones.
Dialogue: 0,0:09:59.14,0:10:03.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Title Six governs cable. Those are two radically different regulatory structures. Gore's idea
Dialogue: 0,0:10:03.75,0:10:08.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,was to put them together in a Title Seven and fundamentally deregulate them--much less
Dialogue: 0,0:10:08.94,0:10:11.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,than even network neutrality regulation would require.
Dialogue: 0,0:10:11.93,0:10:16.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,His team took the idea to Capitol Hill and the chief policy person described--the reaction,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:16.11,0:10:22.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,he said the reaction was quote, "Hell no. If we deregulate these guys, how are we going
Dialogue: 0,0:10:22.86,0:10:29.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to raise money from them?" And you get this kind of sinking, terrifying feeling here,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:29.03,0:10:29.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,right?
Dialogue: 0,0:10:29.44,0:10:35.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Recognizing that we tax in part to make it easy to raise campaign funds. We regulate,
Dialogue: 0,0:10:35.57,0:10:41.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in part, to make it easier to raise campaign funds. Campaign funds driving critical areas
Dialogue: 0,0:10:41.88,0:10:48.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of fiscal policy unrelated to the merits of the underlying fiscal policy. Here's the third
Dialogue: 0,0:10:48.07,0:10:48.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,example.
Dialogue: 0,0:10:48.20,0:10:52.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Think about Wall Street. We've of course seen this collapse on Wall Street, which triggered
Dialogue: 0,0:10:52.33,0:10:57.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a collapse in the economy. What explains that collapse? Well, as Simon Johnson and James
Dialogue: 0,0:10:57.08,0:11:03.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Kwak describe in their book, "13 Bankers," part of the explanation is this perverse mix
Dialogue: 0,0:11:03.24,0:11:06.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of too little government and too much government.
Dialogue: 0,0:11:06.43,0:11:13.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Too little government in the form of deregulation. In the 1990s, we saw an explosion of financial
Dialogue: 0,0:11:13.65,0:11:19.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,innovations, derivatives. But these innovations were essentially invisible to the market because
Dialogue: 0,0:11:19.47,0:11:25.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a series of regulatory changes in the 1990s made derivatives, unlike other financial assets,
Dialogue: 0,0:11:25.98,0:11:30.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,not subject to the standard requirements that have existed since the new deal that they
Dialogue: 0,0:11:30.67,0:11:38.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,be traded on public exchanges, transparently with anti-fraud obligations tied to every
Dialogue: 0,0:11:38.07,0:11:39.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,transaction.
Dialogue: 0,0:11:39.26,0:11:46.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, my colleague, Frank Partnoy, calculated that in 1980, 98 percent of assets traded
Dialogue: 0,0:11:46.14,0:11:55.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in our economy were traded under these standard new deal, trade-based rules. But by 2008,
Dialogue: 0,0:11:55.42,0:12:03.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,90 percent of the assets traded in our economy were exempted from these exchange-based rules,
Dialogue: 0,0:12:03.34,0:12:07.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,could be traded without transparency, could be traded without anybody knowing what the
Dialogue: 0,0:12:07.31,0:12:08.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,prices would be for.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:08.63,0:12:12.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It could be traded without any anti-fraud requirements being tied to them, producing
Dialogue: 0,0:12:12.71,0:12:18.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this shadow banking market, which encouraged--because of the uncertainty it spewed everywhere--the
Dialogue: 0,0:12:18.53,0:12:23.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,bubble which eventually burst and brought the economy down. But that alone, Kwak and
Dialogue: 0,0:12:23.73,0:12:28.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Johnson say, wasn't enough. In addition, we had too much government.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:28.43,0:12:34.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Throughout the 1990s, there was a beacon, a constant signal from the government that
Dialogue: 0,0:12:34.17,0:12:38.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,there was, in effect, a government guarantee that when this bubble burst there would be
Dialogue: 0,0:12:38.92,0:12:45.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a bailout on the other side producing what is the dumbest form of socialism ever invented
Dialogue: 0,0:12:45.22,0:12:49.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,by man--socialized risk and privatized benefit.
Dialogue: 0,0:12:49.94,0:12:56.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We suffer the downside. They get the upside. Now I know you guys are not lawyers. This
Dialogue: 0,0:12:56.67,0:13:01.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is a technical legal term, but this is an insanely stupid way--
Dialogue: 0,0:13:01.60,0:13:02.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:13:02.91,0:13:08.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to set up a financial system. And all that stupidity is just before 2008. Even worse
Dialogue: 0,0:13:08.22,0:13:15.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is after 2008, where we add insult to injury in the way that Congress increasingly functions.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:15.31,0:13:21.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Because after 2008, after the worst crisis since the Depression, after all who are not
Dialogue: 0,0:13:21.10,0:13:26.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,involved in that crisis had concluded that one of the principle causes to that crisis
Dialogue: 0,0:13:26.17,0:13:31.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,was the architecture of deregulation that Wall Street had purchased until 2008, after
Dialogue: 0,0:13:31.74,0:13:37.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the dean of deregulation, the Ayn Rand-ian, Alan Greenspan, Head of the Fed, confessed
Dialogue: 0,0:13:37.27,0:13:41.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in testimony to Congress that he was quote "mistaken" about whether the banks would act
Dialogue: 0,0:13:41.71,0:13:45.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in the public interest as opposed to their private interest.
Dialogue: 0,0:13:45.12,0:13:51.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,After all of that, Wall Street was still powerful enough to blackmail the Democrats and Republicans
Dialogue: 0,0:13:51.62,0:13:59.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,both to give them an essential "get out of jail free" card and to keep the core flaw
Dialogue: 0,0:13:59.41,0:14:02.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of our architecture of regulation the same.
Dialogue: 0,0:14:02.63,0:14:09.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,If the banks were too big to fail before 2008, the banks are only too bigger to fail after
Dialogue: 0,0:14:09.55,0:14:15.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,2008, leading many Independents of Wall Street to include that our risk of a collapse is
Dialogue: 0,0:14:15.84,0:14:21.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,greater today than it was before the collapse in 2008. Again, why? What would explain this
Dialogue: 0,0:14:21.85,0:14:23.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,stupidity in the architecture of regulation?
Dialogue: 0,0:14:23.77,0:14:27.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Well, lots of possible reasons, but here's the one thing we know. The fastest growing
Dialogue: 0,0:14:27.62,0:14:35.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,sector in campaign contributions since 1991, and the largest chunk of contributions in
Dialogue: 0,0:14:35.86,0:14:41.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the 2010 election, come from the finance and insurance industries. OK. Here's one final
Dialogue: 0,0:14:41.53,0:14:41.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,example.
Dialogue: 0,0:14:41.98,0:14:45.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I'm sure many of you, when you saw these images, had a question in the back of your head. How
Dialogue: 0,0:14:45.98,0:14:52.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,was it that it's possible to launch such an experimental drilling platform, as the Deepwater
Dialogue: 0,0:14:52.80,0:14:56.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Horizon, without extensive environmental impact and risk studies?
Dialogue: 0,0:14:56.85,0:15:04.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,All right. In my part of the country, we've just spent nine years and ten thousand pages
Dialogue: 0,0:15:04.09,0:15:09.87,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of environmental impact studies to permit the construction of this green energy technology.
Dialogue: 0,0:15:09.87,0:15:15.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, exactly how much was required before they were able to build the experimental deep water
Dialogue: 0,0:15:15.28,0:15:17.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,drilling platform, which was the Deepwater Horizon?
Dialogue: 0,0:15:17.91,0:15:26.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The answer is 17 pages before they were exempted from any further need for review, leading
Dialogue: 0,0:15:26.05,0:15:28.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Congress to be shocked of course.
Dialogue: 0,0:15:28.69,0:15:35.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[plays video clip] >>Male #1: I am shocked--shocked--to find
Dialogue: 0,0:15:35.17,0:15:35.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that gambling is going on in here.
Dialogue: 0,0:15:35.25,0:15:35.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Male #2: Your winnings, sir.
Dialogue: 0,0:15:35.25,0:15:35.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Male #1: Thank you very much. Everybody out in front.
Dialogue: 0,0:15:35.25,0:15:35.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:15:35.25,0:15:35.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[end video clip]
Dialogue: 0,0:15:35.25,0:15:39.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: And of course, it was Congress that had required these fast track approval
Dialogue: 0,0:15:39.19,0:15:44.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,processes, leading again to the question, "What would ever convince them that fast track
Dialogue: 0,0:15:44.40,0:15:49.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,approval on experimental drilling wells made sense?" Lots of possible answers to that question.
Dialogue: 0,0:15:49.20,0:15:53.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The one thing we know is endless campaign cash driving to this conclusion. Now, here's
Dialogue: 0,0:15:53.49,0:16:02.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the point. No respectable Liberal or Libertarian or Conservative could defend these cases.
Dialogue: 0,0:16:02.93,0:16:08.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Each of them is an abomination from each of those three political philosophy perspectives.
Dialogue: 0,0:16:08.81,0:16:14.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, how is it they become policy in the United States? Now, it turns out political sciences
Dialogue: 0,0:16:14.06,0:16:19.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are uncertain. They say it's a little bit complex. But here's the thing. You believe
Dialogue: 0,0:16:19.20,0:16:25.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you know. I just had to point to point to the money. And you believe you now know the
Dialogue: 0,0:16:25.28,0:16:28.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,root cause to this stupidity.
Dialogue: 0,0:16:28.95,0:16:33.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And that's the core of my claim. Number one, it is because of cases like this, and I could
Dialogue: 0,0:16:33.74,0:16:39.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,go on for hours, I promise--millions of cases like this--that Americans believe money buys
Dialogue: 0,0:16:39.39,0:16:44.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,results in Congress. Seventy-five percent of Americans in a poll that we conducted for
Dialogue: 0,0:16:44.44,0:16:47.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,my book conclude money buys results in Congress.
Dialogue: 0,0:16:47.74,0:16:50.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,You think, "What were the 25 percent thinking?" I don't know.
Dialogue: 0,0:16:50.18,0:16:50.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:16:50.48,0:16:56.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But a little bit more Democrats than Republicans. But I guarantee you when the Republicans were
Dialogue: 0,0:16:56.57,0:17:01.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,not in control, it was just as many Republicans as Democrats. So, whether it's two-thirds
Dialogue: 0,0:17:01.48,0:17:06.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or three-fourths, here's the thing we Americans all agree about.
Dialogue: 0,0:17:06.07,0:17:12.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Money buys results in Congress. Leading to number two. A belief in money buying results
Dialogue: 0,0:17:12.80,0:17:19.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,erodes trust in the institution. So, last year Gallup concluded that eleven percent
Dialogue: 0,0:17:19.11,0:17:25.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of Americans have confidence in Congress. Gallup's number this year is a little more
Dialogue: 0,0:17:25.52,0:17:28.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,optimistic. They say 12 percent.
Dialogue: 0,0:17:28.08,0:17:28.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:17:28.60,0:17:33.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But I just read today in the New York Times--New York Times CBS poll says that nine percent
Dialogue: 0,0:17:33.59,0:17:39.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of Americans have confidence in Congress. To keep this in some context, right, it is
Dialogue: 0,0:17:39.49,0:17:44.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,certainly the case that there were more people who believed in the British crown at the time
Dialogue: 0,0:17:44.67,0:17:48.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of the Revolution than believe in our Congress today.
Dialogue: 0,0:17:48.53,0:17:49.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:17:49.03,0:17:54.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And at what point does an institution have to declare political bankruptcy? At what point
Dialogue: 0,0:17:54.66,0:17:59.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,has it just lost the credibility with the people? What, nine percent isn't enough? Five
Dialogue: 0,0:17:59.30,0:18:05.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,percent? What is the number when we have to say there is no more confidence in this government?
Dialogue: 0,0:18:05.52,0:18:10.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And that leads to number three. Low trust erodes participation in the system. Rock the
Dialogue: 0,0:18:10.27,0:18:14.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Vote, the organization that registered and turned out to vote the largest number of young
Dialogue: 0,0:18:14.23,0:18:19.72,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,people who ever voted in the history of this nation, and arguably delivered the election
Dialogue: 0,0:18:19.72,0:18:24.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to Barack Obama, in 2010, found a large number of their voters were not gonna turn out and
Dialogue: 0,0:18:24.88,0:18:25.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,vote.
Dialogue: 0,0:18:25.21,0:18:29.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, they polled them. Why? Number one answer to that poll by far--two to one over the second
Dialogue: 0,0:18:29.98,0:18:34.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,highest--was "no matter who wins, corporate interest will still have too much power and
Dialogue: 0,0:18:34.86,0:18:40.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,prevent real change." And it's not just kids who think this. The vast majority of people,
Dialogue: 0,0:18:40.16,0:18:45.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,who could have voted, didn't vote and didn't vote in part because of this belief precisely.
Dialogue: 0,0:18:45.46,0:18:50.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Now here, I'm gonna shift into professor mode. Here's my blackboard. It wasn't supposed to
Dialogue: 0,0:18:50.48,0:18:57.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,be this way. That wasn't the intent. Framers of our Constitution gave us, as Conservatives
Dialogue: 0,0:18:57.10,0:19:04.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,like to remind us, a Republic. But what they meant by a Republic was a quote "representative
Dialogue: 0,0:19:04.33,0:19:05.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,democracy."
Dialogue: 0,0:19:05.81,0:19:10.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And what they meant by a representative democracy as Federalist 52 puts it was, "a government
Dialogue: 0,0:19:10.26,0:19:17.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that would have a branch quote 'dependent upon the people alone.'" OK? So, here's the
Dialogue: 0,0:19:17.53,0:19:21.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,model of government. We have the people. We have the government. I do my own slides, so
Dialogue: 0,0:19:21.51,0:19:23.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it's cool the way that bounces, right?
Dialogue: 0,0:19:23.57,0:19:23.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:19:23.90,0:19:29.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The people, the government, marionette relationship between the two. Here's the problem. Congress
Dialogue: 0,0:19:29.24,0:19:34.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,has evolved a different dependence. It's not just the people and the government. Increasingly,
Dialogue: 0,0:19:34.58,0:19:37.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it's the funders and the people and the government.
Dialogue: 0,0:19:37.67,0:19:43.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,In a world where members spend between 30 and 70 percent of their time raising money
Dialogue: 0,0:19:43.90,0:19:49.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to get back to Congress, or to get their Party back into power--they can't help, like each
Dialogue: 0,0:19:49.37,0:19:56.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of you couldn't help--developing a sixth sense, a constant awareness about how what they do
Dialogue: 0,0:19:56.46,0:19:59.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,might affect their ability to raise money.
Dialogue: 0,0:19:59.38,0:20:04.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,In the words of the "X-Files," they become shape-shifters, constantly adjusting their
Dialogue: 0,0:20:04.54,0:20:09.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,positions. Not on issues one to ten, but issue eleven to five hundred in light of what they
Dialogue: 0,0:20:09.71,0:20:14.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,know will raise money. Leslie Byrne describes it when she came to Congress. She's a Democrat
Dialogue: 0,0:20:14.67,0:20:15.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from Virginia.
Dialogue: 0,0:20:15.31,0:20:21.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,She was told by a colleague quote, "Always lean to the green." And then to clarify, she
Dialogue: 0,0:20:21.01,0:20:23.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,went on, "he was not an environmentalist."
Dialogue: 0,0:20:23.38,0:20:24.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:20:24.95,0:20:35.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Now, the point is this a dependence, too. But it's a different and conflicting dependence
Dialogue: 0,0:20:35.03,0:20:44.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from a dependence upon the people alone because--surprise, surprise--the funders are not the people.
Dialogue: 0,0:20:44.23,0:20:50.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Indeed, candidates pay attention in campaigns most to those who max out in the campaign.
Dialogue: 0,0:20:50.24,0:20:55.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, what percentage of Americans maxed out in 2010 in congressional elections in either
Dialogue: 0,0:20:55.15,0:21:02.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of the two cycles? The answer is point zero five percent of Americans. So, the Occupy
Dialogue: 0,0:21:02.48,0:21:06.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Wall Street people are so proud of their slogan, "We are the 99 percent." Bad marketing. They
Dialogue: 0,0:21:06.73,0:21:09.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are the 99 point nine five percent,--
Dialogue: 0,0:21:09.64,0:21:10.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:21:10.46,0:21:15.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,who don't get listened to because they are not in the point zero five percent of people
Dialogue: 0,0:21:15.80,0:21:21.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,who are directly tied into the influence that is our government. Now, this is--Supreme Court
Dialogue: 0,0:21:21.30,0:21:24.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,doesn't recognize this yet, but you should.
Dialogue: 0,0:21:24.10,0:21:31.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,This is corruption. It's not the corruption of brown paper bags secreting cash among members
Dialogue: 0,0:21:31.30,0:21:36.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of Congress. Up through the middle of the 20th Century, members of Congress had safes
Dialogue: 0,0:21:36.64,0:21:41.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in their office for cash. You think to yourselves, "I didn't know that they paid Congressmen
Dialogue: 0,0:21:41.54,0:21:43.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in cash." They didn't.
Dialogue: 0,0:21:43.19,0:21:43.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:21:43.56,0:21:47.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They just discovered that there would be cash on their desk and they needed a place to keep
Dialogue: 0,0:21:47.34,0:21:52.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it. [laughter] So, that was the way things were. But that's not the problem today. Our
Dialogue: 0,0:21:52.39,0:21:56.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Congress, in that sense, is the cleanest Congress in the history of Congress. It's not filled
Dialogue: 0,0:21:56.83,0:21:58.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with Rod Blagojeviches.
Dialogue: 0,0:21:58.22,0:22:02.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It's not filled with people who are violating any law. None of the corruption I'm talking
Dialogue: 0,0:22:02.58,0:22:10.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,about is illegal. It's all legal, in plain sight. But it is corruption because it's relative
Dialogue: 0,0:22:10.54,0:22:16.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to the baseline the framers gave us of the dependence upon the people alone. We have
Dialogue: 0,0:22:16.59,0:22:19.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,corrupted that dependence.
Dialogue: 0,0:22:19.07,0:22:23.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It is a dependence corruption because the wrong dependence has been allowed to step
Dialogue: 0,0:22:23.86,0:22:29.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,into the middle of this system. So then, what does the corruption do? How does it affect
Dialogue: 0,0:22:29.67,0:22:35.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the results? Well, you can think about its effect in substance. But it turns out, interestingly,
Dialogue: 0,0:22:35.59,0:22:41.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,bizarrely, but interestingly, this controversy about whether it affects the results.
Dialogue: 0,0:22:41.47,0:22:47.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,There's some people who believe it doesn't affect the results. Indeed, the former Chairman
Dialogue: 0,0:22:47.21,0:22:54.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of the Federal Election Commission, Bradley Smith--I quote in his book, said this. "The
Dialogue: 0,0:22:54.70,0:22:59.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,evidence is pretty overwhelming that money does not play much of a role in what goes
Dialogue: 0,0:22:59.70,0:23:04.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,on in terms of legislative voting patterns and legislative behavior.
Dialogue: 0,0:23:04.14,0:23:09.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The consensus about that among people who have studied it, is roughly the same as the
Dialogue: 0,0:23:09.59,0:23:13.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,consensus among scientists that global warming is taking place."
Dialogue: 0,0:23:13.54,0:23:14.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:23:14.41,0:23:21.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Now, to be clear, Bradley Smith is not a global warming denier. He is a corruption denier.
Dialogue: 0,0:23:21.00,0:23:24.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And he said this--we were on in interview on the radio. I just couldn't believe it.
Dialogue: 0,0:23:24.02,0:23:27.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I had to tweet it. But then I got in a lot of trouble for this hash tag.
Dialogue: 0,0:23:27.41,0:23:27.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:23:27.64,0:23:30.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But of course, that hash tag just means Bradley Smith--
Dialogue: 0,0:23:30.19,0:23:30.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:23:30.57,0:23:37.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,just talking about--. OK. So, do we have evidence that the results are a function of the money?
Dialogue: 0,0:23:37.49,0:23:41.36,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Well, there's lots of recent studies that are beginning to make this absolutely compelling.
Dialogue: 0,0:23:41.36,0:23:45.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,One of my favorites is this piece by Clayton Peoples that looks at seven thousand votes
Dialogue: 0,0:23:45.46,0:23:47.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,over a period of 1991 to 2006.
Dialogue: 0,0:23:47.56,0:23:52.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It concludes, can show a statistically significant contributor influence in at least seven of
Dialogue: 0,0:23:52.74,0:23:57.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the eight Houses. The one House you couldn't show it was the House that passed the McCain-Feingold
Dialogue: 0,0:23:57.73,0:24:03.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Campaign Reform Act. So they were thinking good in that one term, but not any other period.
Dialogue: 0,0:24:03.02,0:24:07.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But I think more interesting is this piece by Martin Gilens at Princeton. Gilens took
Dialogue: 0,0:24:07.68,0:24:13.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,about 17 hundred public opinion surveys about attitudes about how policy should change.
Dialogue: 0,0:24:13.58,0:24:19.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And he narrowed that down to about 887, where the attitudes of the top ten percent were
Dialogue: 0,0:24:19.70,0:24:22.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,different from the attitudes of the bottom 90 percent.
Dialogue: 0,0:24:22.40,0:24:27.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And he asked the question, "When the top ten percent think we should go left, and the bottom
Dialogue: 0,0:24:27.93,0:24:31.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,90 percent think we should go right"-- I don't mean that left and right politically. I just
Dialogue: 0,0:24:31.33,0:24:34.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,mean go one direction and the other wanna go the other direction. "--which way do we
Dialogue: 0,0:24:34.92,0:24:35.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,go?"
Dialogue: 0,0:24:35.71,0:24:41.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And what he found was "when Americans with different income levels differ in their policy
Dialogue: 0,0:24:41.43,0:24:47.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,preferences, actual policy outcomes strongly reflect the preferences of the most affluent,
Dialogue: 0,0:24:47.13,0:24:53.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,but bare virtually no relationship to the preferences of the poor or middle income Americans."
Dialogue: 0,0:24:53.48,0:24:59.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,There is a vast discrepancy between what our Congress does if it in fact were following
Dialogue: 0,0:24:59.93,0:25:05.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the people alone, and what our Congress does given that it's following the thing I'm taking
Dialogue: 0,0:25:05.32,0:25:09.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for as the proxy for the funders. OK. That's substance.
Dialogue: 0,0:25:09.70,0:25:14.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But here, you can also just more easily identify agenda because remember, Brad Smith also said
Dialogue: 0,0:25:14.14,0:25:19.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it doesn't affect legislative behavior. And here, there is no basis for suggesting it
Dialogue: 0,0:25:19.01,0:25:22.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,doesn't affect legislative behavior. Here's just one example. If I asked you, "What was
Dialogue: 0,0:25:22.61,0:25:28.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the number one issue Congress spent its time on in the first four months of this year?"
Dialogue: 0,0:25:28.68,0:25:33.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It's felt like many years this year, but just the first four months. We're in the middle
Dialogue: 0,0:25:33.70,0:25:39.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of two wars, huge unemployment problems, huge budget deficit problems. Still have a bunch
Dialogue: 0,0:25:39.57,0:25:42.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of questions around health care and still have a bunch of questions around global warming
Dialogue: 0,0:25:42.77,0:25:44.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that have not even begun to be addressed.
Dialogue: 0,0:25:44.44,0:25:49.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,What was the issue they spent most of their time dealing with? The answer is the bank
Dialogue: 0,0:25:49.09,0:25:54.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,swipe fee controversy. Now, what's the bank swipe fee controversy? Well, the bank swipe
Dialogue: 0,0:25:54.33,0:25:58.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,fee controversy is whether banks, when you used your debit card, get to charge more,
Dialogue: 0,0:25:58.47,0:26:02.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,or retailers when you use your debit card get to be charged less for the use of debit
Dialogue: 0,0:26:02.84,0:26:03.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,cards.
Dialogue: 0,0:26:03.75,0:26:08.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,That is the critical national issue that dominated the Congressional agenda for the first four
Dialogue: 0,0:26:08.61,0:26:12.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,months. And you think, "Well, why would that ever be? Why would swipe fees be the center
Dialogue: 0,0:26:12.44,0:26:13.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of what they care about?"
Dialogue: 0,0:26:13.32,0:26:18.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,How many members of Congress got elected going down there saying, "The thing I'm going for
Dialogue: 0,0:26:18.05,0:26:22.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is to deal with that swipe fee controversy." Right? Well, the answer is one Senator described
Dialogue: 0,0:26:22.66,0:26:26.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it like this. "The fights down here can be put into two or three categories: The big
Dialogue: 0,0:26:26.51,0:26:31.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,greedy bastards against the big greedy bastards; the big greedy bastards against the little
Dialogue: 0,0:26:31.34,0:26:36.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,greedy bastards; and some cases even the other little greedy bastards against the other little
Dialogue: 0,0:26:36.06,0:26:37.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,greedy bastards."
Dialogue: 0,0:26:37.71,0:26:38.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:26:38.33,0:26:42.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So we have this kind of controversy. And here's the money line, so to speak. I don't even
Dialogue: 0,0:26:42.00,0:26:47.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,think the authors, Zach Carter and Ryan Grimm, saw the significance of this, but this is
Dialogue: 0,0:26:47.52,0:26:49.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the real money line in the piece.
Dialogue: 0,0:26:49.04,0:26:54.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They say, "The clock never ticks down to zero in Washington: one year's law is the next
Dialogue: 0,0:26:54.00,0:26:59.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,year's repeal target. Politicians, showered with cash from card companies and giant retailers
Dialogue: 0,0:26:59.86,0:27:06.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,alike, have been moving back and forth between camps, paid handsomely for their shifting
Dialogue: 0,0:27:06.10,0:27:06.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,allegiances."
Dialogue: 0,0:27:06.77,0:27:13.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, it's not just tax policy that gets architected to raise money for members of Congress. It's
Dialogue: 0,0:27:13.15,0:27:17.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,not just regulation that gets architected to make it easy to raise money for members
Dialogue: 0,0:27:17.76,0:27:22.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of Congress. It's the very agenda of what Congress addresses that gets set in a way
Dialogue: 0,0:27:22.80,0:27:25.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to make it easier for members to raise money.
Dialogue: 0,0:27:25.77,0:27:30.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So why don't we address unemployment? Turns out unemployment doesn't pay so well [laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:27:30.25,0:27:35.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,for Congressmen raising money for their campaigns. Now, my view is we critically need a way to
Dialogue: 0,0:27:35.84,0:27:41.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,change this. And we change this by fixing the dependence. If the problem here is that
Dialogue: 0,0:27:41.22,0:27:48.87,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the funders are not the people, a solution is to make the funders the people, to give
Dialogue: 0,0:27:48.87,0:27:49.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,them a way--.
Dialogue: 0,0:27:49.33,0:27:54.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I know that looks like one word. I mean two words, here. I don't mean give Congress away.
Dialogue: 0,0:27:54.66,0:27:59.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I know a lot of people would like to do that. I mean, give Congress a way to fund their
Dialogue: 0,0:27:59.41,0:28:05.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,campaigns without Faust, without selling their souls, and thereby without alienating America.
Dialogue: 0,0:28:05.74,0:28:10.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And the one way, and I increasing think the only way to do this, is to commit to a system
Dialogue: 0,0:28:10.39,0:28:15.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of publicly funding public elections. Now, a particular brand of public funding is what
Dialogue: 0,0:28:15.89,0:28:21.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I want to pedal here. I want a public funding that changes from large-dollar funded campaigns
Dialogue: 0,0:28:21.81,0:28:23.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to small-dollar funded campaigns.
Dialogue: 0,0:28:23.61,0:28:28.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And there are lots of examples of this around the country. Three states in particular, Arizona,
Dialogue: 0,0:28:28.70,0:28:34.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Maine, and Connecticut, have systems where candidates opt into a regime where they take
Dialogue: 0,0:28:34.42,0:28:40.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,small dollar contributions only and the regime effectively amplifies those contributions,
Dialogue: 0,0:28:40.15,0:28:45.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,so that they can successfully wage a campaign having never taken a large dollar contribution
Dialogue: 0,0:28:45.22,0:28:45.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from anybody.
Dialogue: 0,0:28:45.94,0:28:50.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,There are many ways to do that. I describe one in my book that's a little different from
Dialogue: 0,0:28:50.29,0:28:55.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,what Maine and Connecticut have done. And I can talk about that in questions, but the
Dialogue: 0,0:28:55.60,0:29:00.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,point I want you to recognize, the critical point about this way of funding elections,
Dialogue: 0,0:29:00.17,0:29:05.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is if we had an election where the majority of Congress--the vast majority of Congress--took
Dialogue: 0,0:29:05.70,0:29:14.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,small dollar contributions only, then we all could believe, as we all want to believe,
Dialogue: 0,0:29:14.11,0:29:18.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter] that when Congress did something stupid it was either because there were too
Dialogue: 0,0:29:18.07,0:29:22.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,many Democrats or because there were too many Republicans, or because they just didn't understand
Dialogue: 0,0:29:22.16,0:29:23.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,what they were doing.
Dialogue: 0,0:29:23.55,0:29:30.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But not because of the money. The essential element of mistrust and cynicism in the system
Dialogue: 0,0:29:30.67,0:29:35.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,would've been removed by an alternative funding system that gave us no reason to doubt the
Dialogue: 0,0:29:35.93,0:29:39.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,integrity or credibility of what that system was doing.
Dialogue: 0,0:29:39.54,0:29:47.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Now, this is a way, I believe, to create a reassertion of the dominance of the people
Dialogue: 0,0:29:47.18,0:29:51.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and the dependence the framers intended and to restore the institution of Congress to
Dialogue: 0,0:29:51.57,0:29:55.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,at least be a little bit more popular than King George at the founding.
Dialogue: 0,0:29:55.89,0:29:56.09,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:29:56.09,0:30:00.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,OK. Now that's the argument. Here's the hard question. How do you get there? I don't think
Dialogue: 0,0:30:00.42,0:30:05.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it's hard to describe the problem. We all believe we believed in the problem before
Dialogue: 0,0:30:05.55,0:30:06.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I even said anything about it.
Dialogue: 0,0:30:06.85,0:30:10.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And it's not even hard, I think, to describe a solution. I'm happy to tell you more about
Dialogue: 0,0:30:10.15,0:30:16.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,mine, but I think the solution is pretty clear. What is hard--maybe what's impossibly hard--is
Dialogue: 0,0:30:16.65,0:30:23.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to imagine the political movement that brings about the solution. And the reason for that
Dialogue: 0,0:30:23.16,0:30:28.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is an insight given to me by Congressman Jim Cooper, Democrat from Tennessee, who has been
Dialogue: 0,0:30:28.33,0:30:30.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in Congress for as long all but about 20 other members of Congress.
Dialogue: 0,0:30:30.98,0:30:35.36,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And Cooper said this. He told me "the problem with Capitol Hill is it has become a quote
Dialogue: 0,0:30:35.36,0:30:43.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,'Farm league for K Street.'" K Street, the home of lobbyists. A farm league for K Street,
Dialogue: 0,0:30:43.29,0:30:47.29,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,meaning members and staffers and bureaucrats have this increasingly common business model
Dialogue: 0,0:30:47.29,0:30:48.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in the back of their head.
Dialogue: 0,0:30:48.40,0:30:55.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The business model is focused on their life after government, their life as lobbyists.
Dialogue: 0,0:30:55.57,0:31:00.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Public Citizen calculated between 1998 and 2004, 50 percent of Senators left to become
Dialogue: 0,0:31:00.71,0:31:04.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,lobbyists. Forty-two percent of the members of the House. Those numbers have only gone
Dialogue: 0,0:31:04.83,0:31:06.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,up.
Dialogue: 0,0:31:06.25,0:31:11.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And so, in a world where everyone depends upon the existing system surviving, because
Dialogue: 0,0:31:11.98,0:31:18.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that's the only way they have a lucrative after-government future, how to we begin to
Dialogue: 0,0:31:18.85,0:31:25.05,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,imagine that institution and those people--the lobbyists, the members of Congress, the staffers,
Dialogue: 0,0:31:25.05,0:31:30.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the bureaucrats--ever organizing to change that deeply corrupt system?
Dialogue: 0,0:31:30.30,0:31:35.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Well, in my book, I consider four ideas. One of them is the ordinary idea--the idea of
Dialogue: 0,0:31:35.73,0:31:40.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,passing a statute. That idea is impossible. I looked it up on Google. It is impossible.
Dialogue: 0,0:31:40.30,0:31:40.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:31:40.89,0:31:46.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It's technically impossible. It's impossible because there is no way they will ever radically
Dialogue: 0,0:31:46.61,0:31:52.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,change the system that both got them there and will carry them out in very well-paid
Dialogue: 0,0:31:52.68,0:31:58.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,lobbyist’s jobs. So that leads me to three insane solutions that are only improbable,
Dialogue: 0,0:31:58.99,0:32:00.50,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,not quite impossible.
Dialogue: 0,0:32:00.50,0:32:03.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And the third of these, the one that I ultimately think will be the most important, is this
Dialogue: 0,0:32:03.91,0:32:10.72,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,suggestion of a convention. So, the framers of our Constitution in Article Five created
Dialogue: 0,0:32:10.72,0:32:15.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the standard way by which the Constitution gets amended. That is, Congress proposes an
Dialogue: 0,0:32:15.91,0:32:19.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,amendment and three-fourths of the states ratify it.
Dialogue: 0,0:32:19.58,0:32:23.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But then at the convention, somebody said, "Well, what if Congress is the problem? What
Dialogue: 0,0:32:23.28,0:32:29.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,do we do then?" And so, they set up an alternative path. The alternative path is that states
Dialogue: 0,0:32:29.73,0:32:34.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,can call on Congress to call a convention. The convention then proposes the amendments
Dialogue: 0,0:32:34.83,0:32:37.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and those amendments have to pass by three-fourths of the states.
Dialogue: 0,0:32:37.73,0:32:42.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So either way, 38 states have to ratify an amendment, but the sources of those amendments
Dialogue: 0,0:32:42.53,0:32:49.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are different. One is inside. One is outside. Now, all three of these insane ideas are really
Dialogue: 0,0:32:49.07,0:32:55.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,just ways around what is, I think, the cancer that is DC right now. And it's recognition
Dialogue: 0,0:32:55.47,0:33:03.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that the ordinary means of politics are just not feasible for this kind of problem.
Dialogue: 0,0:33:03.06,0:33:07.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,In this--you can think of--extraordinary times, what's gonna be required here is that we do
Dialogue: 0,0:33:07.66,0:33:15.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,something that we have not done in a very long time--to build a politics that looks
Dialogue: 0,0:33:15.06,0:33:23.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,different from this. A politics that is not--to borrow from my older work-- a 'read-only'
Dialogue: 0,0:33:23.03,0:33:30.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,politics--where people sit there and passively consume what's fed to them in broadcast form.
Dialogue: 0,0:33:30.59,0:33:34.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But instead, read/write politics where people become more active and engaged and reclaim
Dialogue: 0,0:33:34.90,0:33:41.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this from the politicians. Now, here's the hard part. I don't actually know whether it's
Dialogue: 0,0:33:41.55,0:33:47.00,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,possible for us to do it. We don't have any good evidence that we, as a people, have the
Dialogue: 0,0:33:47.00,0:33:53.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,capacity to actually take back power from the professional politicians and reorder it.
Dialogue: 0,0:33:53.96,0:33:59.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,No good example in our recent past. Lots of good reason to believe people are too disengaged
Dialogue: 0,0:33:59.86,0:34:08.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to be able to do it. I do think we know, however, how that process gets started. And it begins
Dialogue: 0,0:34:08.15,0:34:17.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with, first, clarity. The clarity of Thoreau. The clarity of a root striker.
Dialogue: 0,0:34:17.20,0:34:20.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So it might not be surprising that the coolest website of the Occupy movement is the Occupy
Dialogue: 0,0:34:20.73,0:34:27.08,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Seattle movement. But if you go to their demands page, you're met with this list of literally
Dialogue: 0,0:34:27.08,0:34:31.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,hundreds of demands, which they are now trying to decide which are the most important of
Dialogue: 0,0:34:31.66,0:34:33.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,their demands.
Dialogue: 0,0:34:33.74,0:34:39.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Everything from protect the environment to--my favorite--end the industrial prison complex.
Dialogue: 0,0:34:39.75,0:34:45.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,OK. Which is significant there and also here, but that's the scope. All right. Now, I think
Dialogue: 0,0:34:45.82,0:34:49.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,all of these demands are important. It would be great to get Congress or the states to
Dialogue: 0,0:34:49.93,0:34:52.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,address any of these demands.
Dialogue: 0,0:34:52.17,0:34:56.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But the point is if you come forward with a list of a hundred demands, you come forward
Dialogue: 0,0:34:56.90,0:35:03.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,with noise. And nobody hears anything because they can't hear everything you're trying to
Dialogue: 0,0:35:03.70,0:35:10.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,say. Instead, this movement needs to find a way to clarify and focus. It needs to celebrate
Dialogue: 0,0:35:10.76,0:35:14.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,its diversity, recognize there are leftists in that movement.
Dialogue: 0,0:35:14.03,0:35:18.21,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They shouldn't deny the fact they're leftists. There are people on the right in the Tea Party
Dialogue: 0,0:35:18.21,0:35:21.36,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,movement. They shouldn't deny they're from the right. They should all stick to their
Dialogue: 0,0:35:21.36,0:35:25.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,principle, but they've got to seek a common ground.
Dialogue: 0,0:35:25.73,0:35:32.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Not compromise, but a common ground so that they actually do speak for the 99 percent,
Dialogue: 0,0:35:32.25,0:35:36.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,not just the 21 percent of people who identify as liberals or the 30 percent of people that
Dialogue: 0,0:35:36.93,0:35:42.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,identify as supporters of the Tea Party. I think there's an exercise we all should go
Dialogue: 0,0:35:42.10,0:35:42.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,through.
Dialogue: 0,0:35:42.27,0:35:47.97,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We should be forced to come into a room and say, "We on the left, believe this. We on
Dialogue: 0,0:35:47.97,0:35:54.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the right, believe this." But then ask the critical question, whether there's a set of
Dialogue: 0,0:35:54.07,0:36:00.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,beliefs that we all share, that could be the foundation for some important reform. And
Dialogue: 0,0:36:00.79,0:36:07.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,my view is that if we could focus people's attention on the wide range of issues that
Dialogue: 0,0:36:07.94,0:36:13.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,they're frustrated about and get them to connect the dots--so whether it's on the left, health
Dialogue: 0,0:36:13.92,0:36:16.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,care reform, or on the right, government bailouts.
Dialogue: 0,0:36:16.59,0:36:21.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,On the left, global warming or on the right, complex taxes. On the left, financial reform
Dialogue: 0,0:36:21.43,0:36:25.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and on the right, financial reform. Whatever the issue is, if we could focus them, they
Dialogue: 0,0:36:25.77,0:36:34.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,would see this root cause. And the root cause is this picture. A democracy that is distracted
Dialogue: 0,0:36:34.04,0:36:36.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,by a dependence that was never intended.
Dialogue: 0,0:36:36.32,0:36:43.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And the practice of the root striker has got to be to find a way to get, we the people,
Dialogue: 0,0:36:43.44,0:36:52.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to see this root. So, that's number one--clarity. Number two is a kind of boldness. Now, in
Dialogue: 0,0:36:52.51,0:36:58.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the book, I make a little bit of fun of a guy you're familiar with.
Dialogue: 0,0:36:58.26,0:36:59.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:36:59.07,0:37:05.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, Eric Schmidt came to a talk at the American Academy in Berlin. And it was the first time
Dialogue: 0,0:37:05.66,0:37:09.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I'd ever met him, first time I'd ever heard him talk. And I was amazed. It was the first
Dialogue: 0,0:37:09.28,0:37:14.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,time I'd ever heard anybody lay out the Google vision.
Dialogue: 0,0:37:14.40,0:37:18.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I was astonished. I mean, I was astonished by him. He was extraordinary, but I was astonished
Dialogue: 0,0:37:18.93,0:37:25.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,by the Google vision. This is a place. You saw these really big ideas about how they
Dialogue: 0,0:37:25.15,0:37:30.06,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,were gonna, you guys, were gonna remake the whole world. The whole world.
Dialogue: 0,0:37:30.06,0:37:34.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I was more excited about the work going on here than I had even been in my whole life.
Dialogue: 0,0:37:34.37,0:37:40.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I felt like this was amazing. So then I thought, "OK. Wow. This is a company of big ideas."
Dialogue: 0,0:37:40.01,0:37:46.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I said, "Eric, so there's a whole bunch of public policy issues where the world is
Dialogue: 0,0:37:46.42,0:37:47.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,against you guys.
Dialogue: 0,0:37:47.80,0:37:55.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I think you guys are right." So, immigration, anti-trust, copyrights, network neutrality.
Dialogue: 0,0:37:55.54,0:37:59.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,You guys are on the right side of all of those issues and the rest of the world is on the
Dialogue: 0,0:37:59.18,0:38:03.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,wrong side." And the reason the rest of the world is on the wrong side is exactly the
Dialogue: 0,0:38:03.37,0:38:05.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,corruption that I've been talking about today.
Dialogue: 0,0:38:05.12,0:38:10.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, what are you gonna do about it? Are you gonna sit around and swipe away these bad
Dialogue: 0,0:38:10.30,0:38:15.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,policies like flies at a picnic? Or are you gonna solve it in the way Google addresses
Dialogue: 0,0:38:15.18,0:38:20.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a problem and radically remakes the world to solve it? And for the first time in that
Dialogue: 0,0:38:20.40,0:38:24.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,evening, a tiny idea was expressed.
Dialogue: 0,0:38:24.55,0:38:28.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And it was expressed by Eric Schmidt. Because he didn't have any big idea to think about
Dialogue: 0,0:38:28.04,0:38:33.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,solving this, the most fundamental problem. I agree with Matt that we, as a Republic face--any
Dialogue: 0,0:38:33.15,0:38:37.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,idea like, "Oh, we're gonna get the Google PAC to be more aggressive in teaching people
Dialogue: 0,0:38:37.61,0:38:39.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,what our views about policies were.
Dialogue: 0,0:38:39.56,0:38:45.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Nothing to change the core root of the problem. Just playing the system with all sorts of
Dialogue: 0,0:38:45.43,0:38:53.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,resources allied against you. What we need here is a Google-level idea. What we need
Dialogue: 0,0:38:53.81,0:38:59.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is the kind of big idea that you deploy in every other sphere of social life that might
Dialogue: 0,0:38:59.34,0:39:05.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,get this democracy to the place that could address this problem that I guarantee you
Dialogue: 0,0:39:05.02,0:39:12.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,95 percent of experts say is impossible for the world to solve, for us to solve.
Dialogue: 0,0:39:12.04,0:39:17.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Impossible. But that's the sort of problem you guys take all the time. That's what you
Dialogue: 0,0:39:17.17,0:39:22.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,do. That's your job--the impossible problem. And we need that. And we need that from people
Dialogue: 0,0:39:22.90,0:39:26.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,like you. Now, number three, we need courage. And this is also related to the company, but
Dialogue: 0,0:39:26.30,0:39:28.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I won't pick on the company anymore.
Dialogue: 0,0:39:28.11,0:39:33.85,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Instead, I'll talk about my friend, Arnold Hiatt. So, he's a humble guy. This is the
Dialogue: 0,0:39:33.85,0:39:36.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,biggest I could find of him on the net.
Dialogue: 0,0:39:36.30,0:39:37.03,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:39:37.03,0:39:39.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[Lawrence Lessig coughs]
Dialogue: 0,0:39:39.22,0:39:44.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Arnie was the president of Stride Rite. They make great shoes, like Keds. He's also a loyal
Dialogue: 0,0:39:44.32,0:39:50.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Democrat. In 1996, he was the second largest contributor to the Democratic Party. So, in
Dialogue: 0,0:39:50.88,0:39:55.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,1997, Bill Clinton invited him and 30 other large contributors to a dinner at the Mayflower
Dialogue: 0,0:39:55.91,0:39:59.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Hotel to tell him, the President, what he should do for the remaining part of his term.
Dialogue: 0,0:39:59.73,0:40:06.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, it's this dinner of these fat cats at the Mayflower Hotel to help guide policy in
Dialogue: 0,0:40:06.59,0:40:09.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,America. And each of them got to stand up and address the President. We didn't have
Dialogue: 0,0:40:09.89,0:40:13.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,any pictures. Arnie was the last one to speak. I kind of envision it like this.
Dialogue: 0,0:40:13.92,0:40:18.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,He stood up and he looked the President straight in the eye and he said, "Mr. President, I
Dialogue: 0,0:40:18.67,0:40:25.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,know you're an admirer of Franklin Delano Roosevelt. So I want you to put yourself in
Dialogue: 0,0:40:25.89,0:40:33.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Roosevelt's shoes in 1940, when he reluctantly came to recognize that he needed to convince
Dialogue: 0,0:40:33.44,0:40:38.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a reluctant nation to wage a war to save democracy."
Dialogue: 0,0:40:38.24,0:40:44.32,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,'Cause he said, "You, too, Mr. President. You, too, need to convince a reluctant nation
Dialogue: 0,0:40:44.32,0:40:53.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to wage a war to save democracy. Not a war against fascists, but in a certain sense,
Dialogue: 0,0:40:53.78,0:40:59.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a war against us fat cats." A war against people who believe, merely because they are
Dialogue: 0,0:40:59.84,0:41:03.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,rich, they are entitled to guide government policy.
Dialogue: 0,0:41:03.93,0:41:06.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,People who believe merely because they've been successful in the marketplace, they're
Dialogue: 0,0:41:06.71,0:41:12.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,entitled to have dinner with the President. People who have convinced the American public
Dialogue: 0,0:41:12.67,0:41:19.97,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that this republic does not work. Now, put yourself in Hiatt's shoes. Imagine yourself
Dialogue: 0,0:41:19.97,0:41:24.100,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,in that room with 30 other fat cats and the President, basically saying to each of those
Dialogue: 0,0:41:24.100,0:41:29.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,fat cats and the President, "This is illegitimate what's happening here."
Dialogue: 0,0:41:29.80,0:41:32.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,There was silence after he said what he said.
Dialogue: 0,0:41:32.53,0:41:33.43,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:41:33.43,0:41:37.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,The only published account of the evening says that Clinton's response effectively slashed
Dialogue: 0,0:41:37.57,0:41:45.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Hiatt to pieces, humiliating him in front of the group. I think 14 years later, we need
Dialogue: 0,0:41:45.24,0:41:49.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to recognize that it was Arnold Hiatt who was right.
Dialogue: 0,0:41:49.46,0:41:55.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,We do need to convince a reluctant nation to wage a war to save democracy. But where
Dialogue: 0,0:41:55.84,0:42:02.60,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Arnold Hiatt was wrong was in his belief that politicians would wage that war. It's not
Dialogue: 0,0:42:02.60,0:42:08.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,gonna be politicians. It's gonna be citizens. It's going to be us. It's going to be root
Dialogue: 0,0:42:08.66,0:42:09.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,strikers.
Dialogue: 0,0:42:09.99,0:42:17.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I pray it's going to be you. It is our job that requires our courage. It is our republic.
Dialogue: 0,0:42:17.13,0:42:25.22,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It is ours, not theirs. They took it away, but we let them. Here's one more story before
Dialogue: 0,0:42:25.22,0:42:31.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I stop. So, many of you might remember--actually, many of you weren't born, but OK.
Dialogue: 0,0:42:31.48,0:42:40.63,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Many of you might remember this event, 1989. The Exxon Valdez crashed into Prince William
Dialogue: 0,0:42:40.63,0:42:47.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Sound, ran aground, eleven million gallons of oil was spilled into the Sound. This is
Dialogue: 0,0:42:47.02,0:42:51.50,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the recording of Captain Joseph Hazelwood when he called in the accident.
Dialogue: 0,0:42:51.50,0:42:53.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[plays sound clip]
Dialogue: 0,0:42:53.62,0:42:54.33,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[static]
Dialogue: 0,0:42:54.33,0:43:03.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Captain Joseph Hazelwood: Yeah. Ah, it’s VALDEZ back. Ah, we’ve— ah, should be
Dialogue: 0,0:43:03.51,0:43:14.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,on your radar there— we’ve fetched up, ah, hard aground north of, ah, Goose Island
Dialogue: 0,0:43:14.11,0:43:26.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,off Bligh Reef. And, ah, evidently, ah, leaking some oil, and, ah, we’re gonna be here for
Dialogue: 0,0:43:26.12,0:43:30.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a while. And, ah, if you want, ah, so you’re notified. Over.
Dialogue: 0,0:43:30.47,0:43:30.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[end sound clip]
Dialogue: 0,0:43:30.47,0:43:34.93,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: And ah, if you want, as, so you're notified. Over. Now, as many of
Dialogue: 0,0:43:34.93,0:43:39.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you are thinking, there might be a little bit of a question about whether Captain Joseph
Dialogue: 0,0:43:39.01,0:43:44.95,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Hazelwood was intoxicated at the time this accident occurred. He denied it. He said he
Dialogue: 0,0:43:44.95,0:43:47.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,only had four vodkas before he got on the ship.
Dialogue: 0,0:43:47.81,0:43:51.58,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But his blood level alcohol indicated he must have been at least six times over the legal
Dialogue: 0,0:43:51.58,0:43:58.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,limit when he climbed on board that ship. But he fought it. His lawyers fought it hard.
Dialogue: 0,0:43:58.14,0:44:02.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,There was some ambiguity in the evidence and he was not convicted. So, let's say there
Dialogue: 0,0:44:02.67,0:44:09.34,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,was doubt about whether Hazelwood was drunk when he was captaining a supertanker.
Dialogue: 0,0:44:09.34,0:44:15.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,What there was no doubt about was that he had a problem with alcohol. His mother testified.
Dialogue: 0,0:44:15.13,0:44:20.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,She had known he had a problem with alcohol. In 1985, four years before the accident, Exxon
Dialogue: 0,0:44:20.27,0:44:24.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,had treated him for his problem with alcohol. After the accident, Exxon's President said
Dialogue: 0,0:44:24.40,0:44:26.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,he "thought he had mastered the problem."
Dialogue: 0,0:44:26.38,0:44:33.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But in 1986, he had his driver's license revoked for a DUI. In 1988, he had his driver's license
Dialogue: 0,0:44:33.18,0:44:38.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,revoked for a DUI. At the time he was captaining a supertanker, he was not allowed to drive
Dialogue: 0,0:44:38.27,0:44:39.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a VW Beetle.
Dialogue: 0,0:44:39.56,0:44:40.52,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:44:40.52,0:44:50.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,OK. But forget Hazelwood. Instead, I want you to think about those around Captain Hazelwood,
Dialogue: 0,0:44:50.25,0:44:56.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,these other officers. People who could have picked up a phone while a drunk was driving
Dialogue: 0,0:44:56.70,0:45:01.13,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a supertanker. I want you to think about the people who did nothing because all but one
Dialogue: 0,0:45:01.13,0:45:04.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of those officers did nothing.
Dialogue: 0,0:45:04.86,0:45:10.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,What do we think about them? Now, I ask this question because as I think about the problem
Dialogue: 0,0:45:10.88,0:45:18.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,this nation faces increasingly, I believe we are they. This nation faces critical problems
Dialogue: 0,0:45:18.82,0:45:22.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,requiring serious attention, but we don't have institutions capable of giving them this
Dialogue: 0,0:45:22.70,0:45:22.100,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,attention.
Dialogue: 0,0:45:22.100,0:45:34.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,They are distracted, unable to focus. And who is to blame for that? Who is responsible?
Dialogue: 0,0:45:34.53,0:45:40.20,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think it's too easy to point to the Blagojeviches and hold them responsible, to point to the
Dialogue: 0,0:45:40.20,0:45:45.100,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,evil people and hold them responsible. It's not the evil people. It’s the good people.
Dialogue: 0,0:45:45.100,0:45:47.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It's the decent people.
Dialogue: 0,0:45:47.74,0:45:55.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It's the people who could've picked up a phone. It's us. It's we, the most privileged. Because
Dialogue: 0,0:45:55.14,0:45:59.71,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the most outrageous part here is that these corruptions, of course, were primed by the
Dialogue: 0,0:45:59.71,0:46:07.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,most privileged, but they were permitted by the passivity of the most privileged as well--permitted
Dialogue: 0,0:46:07.70,0:46:09.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,by us.
Dialogue: 0,0:46:09.42,0:46:15.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,When Ben Franklin was carried from the Constitutional Convention in the summer of 1787, a woman
Dialogue: 0,0:46:15.57,0:46:20.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,stopped him on the street and said, "Mr. Franklin, what have you wrought?" Franklin replied,
Dialogue: 0,0:46:20.01,0:46:30.41,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,"A republic, ma'am, if you can keep it." A republic. A representative democracy.
Dialogue: 0,0:46:30.41,0:46:41.77,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,A democracy dependent upon the people alone. We have lost that republic and all of us have
Dialogue: 0,0:46:41.77,0:46:53.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to work to get it back. Thank you very much.
Dialogue: 0,0:46:53.26,0:46:54.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[applause]
Dialogue: 0,0:46:54.99,0:47:08.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I'm happy to take questions. I'm a law professor, so I could call on people if you don't ask
Dialogue: 0,0:47:08.49,0:47:09.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,questions.
Dialogue: 0,0:47:09.17,0:47:09.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[laughter]
Dialogue: 0,0:47:09.86,0:47:11.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Yes, sir.
Dialogue: 0,0:47:11.24,0:47:18.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #1: Do you have any opinions on electoral reform? I can't vote for the party I want
Dialogue: 0,0:47:18.44,0:47:22.100,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,'cause if I vote for anybody other than Republicans or Democrats, my vote is wasted.
Dialogue: 0,0:47:22.100,0:47:26.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Yeah. I think that there's a whole list of other reforms that we also
Dialogue: 0,0:47:26.78,0:47:33.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,need to think about with democracy. The way we gerrymander districts, the way we have
Dialogue: 0,0:47:33.27,0:47:38.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,winner-take-all seats. All of these things I think are critically important, too. I'm
Dialogue: 0,0:47:38.10,0:47:41.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,trying to think about the sequence of problems.
Dialogue: 0,0:47:41.70,0:47:45.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I think the sequence of problems is, this is the problem we need to solve first to create
Dialogue: 0,0:47:45.38,0:47:49.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,an atmosphere, an opportunity, to begin to address the other problems. So, I'm happy
Dialogue: 0,0:47:49.04,0:47:54.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to sign up with you on that once we fix the problem I'm talking about here first. Yeah.
Dialogue: 0,0:47:54.46,0:47:58.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #2: Hi. Two quick questions. The first is, what's the name of the Senator that came
Dialogue: 0,0:47:58.30,0:48:01.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,up with the little bastards that are greedy in the greedy bastards quote?
Dialogue: 0,0:48:01.55,0:48:05.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: He would not go on the record with him name, [audience chuckles]
Dialogue: 0,0:48:05.47,0:48:09.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,so the Huffington Post piece says it's an anonymous Senator who said this.
Dialogue: 0,0:48:09.23,0:48:14.96,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #2: OK. Secondly, about the Constitution Convention, using say, legislatures. How are
Dialogue: 0,0:48:14.96,0:48:17.100,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the state representatives gonna be different from the national representatives? 'Cause
Dialogue: 0,0:48:17.100,0:48:22.12,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,aren't they just as greedy and looking to climb the ladder of political opportunity?
Dialogue: 0,0:48:22.12,0:48:27.16,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Yeah, so state legislatures just passed resolutions calling on the Convention.
Dialogue: 0,0:48:27.16,0:48:30.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And the question is, how do you populate the Convention? And here's the really insane,
Dialogue: 0,0:48:30.66,0:48:34.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,totally completely insane idea, that I have for the Convention.
Dialogue: 0,0:48:34.14,0:48:38.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think the Convention should be populated by a random selection, random proportional
Dialogue: 0,0:48:38.66,0:48:45.79,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,selection, of citizens. Now, people think that's crazy. And I agree. You're not gonna
Dialogue: 0,0:48:45.79,0:48:47.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,argue anybody into insanity.
Dialogue: 0,0:48:47.59,0:48:54.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think what you've gotta do is to show them, like let's run 30 or 40 or 50 of these mock
Dialogue: 0,0:48:54.25,0:48:58.82,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Constitutional Conventions where we have deliberative polls where we randomly select a representative
Dialogue: 0,0:48:58.82,0:49:03.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,mix of people from a jurisdiction and we give them the information they need.
Dialogue: 0,0:49:03.44,0:49:07.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And we have them work through the issue and see what they come up with. California has
Dialogue: 0,0:49:07.28,0:49:11.25,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a good example of this. The California Forward Project ran a deliberative project, deliberative
Dialogue: 0,0:49:11.25,0:49:15.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,poll, around the question of what California should do. And the product of that is extraordinarily
Dialogue: 0,0:49:15.86,0:49:20.48,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,impressive--much better than anything the professionals did.
Dialogue: 0,0:49:20.48,0:49:25.45,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I think that signals the core insight, which is politics is one of these rare sports
Dialogue: 0,0:49:25.45,0:49:29.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,where the amateurs are actually better than the professional. Because the professional
Dialogue: 0,0:49:29.18,0:49:35.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is good at figuring out how to benefit the special interests that the professional depends
Dialogue: 0,0:49:35.38,0:49:35.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,upon.
Dialogue: 0,0:49:35.88,0:49:41.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And the amateur, like a jury, can be summoned into a state where they're not thinking so
Dialogue: 0,0:49:41.38,0:49:45.62,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,much about the special interest. So, I think the only way a Convention makes sense is if
Dialogue: 0,0:49:45.62,0:49:49.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,we can avoid it being captured in exactly the same way government has been captured.
Dialogue: 0,0:49:49.57,0:49:54.100,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I think the only way to that is to have this randomly selected body be the Convention.
Dialogue: 0,0:49:54.100,0:50:00.76,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #3: First of all, thank you so much for being here and for devoting so much time
Dialogue: 0,0:50:00.76,0:50:01.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to this very important issue.
Dialogue: 0,0:50:01.86,0:50:02.86,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Thank you.
Dialogue: 0,0:50:02.86,0:50:11.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #3: My question is, given the election of Obama in 2008, and then the following three
Dialogue: 0,0:50:11.04,0:50:17.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,years, how much of the overwhelming Democratic majorities and the election Obama have helped
Dialogue: 0,0:50:17.99,0:50:21.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the momentum of this campaign finance reform campaign?
Dialogue: 0,0:50:21.49,0:50:25.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,In that, I think there's a lot of people who sort of generally understand the Republicans
Dialogue: 0,0:50:25.90,0:50:32.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,were bought, but I think when the nation was rallied around this feeling in 2008, and then
Dialogue: 0,0:50:32.92,0:50:36.11,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the disappointment that's come out of it, I just--.
Dialogue: 0,0:50:36.11,0:50:44.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Yeah. You and I share that view precisely. The book is--. Obama was a
Dialogue: 0,0:50:44.53,0:50:48.92,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,friend. He was a colleague of mine in Chicago. I campaigned for him. I worked hard for him.
Dialogue: 0,0:50:48.92,0:50:54.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I talked to a lot of people in here when he first was on the trail about how he'd be so
Dialogue: 0,0:50:54.42,0:50:56.97,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,great for what we cared about.
Dialogue: 0,0:50:56.97,0:51:02.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But the only reason I think he was credible as a candidate over Hilary Clinton, was that
Dialogue: 0,0:51:02.04,0:51:06.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,he, unlike Hilary Clinton, said, "This system is the problem. We have to take up the fight
Dialogue: 0,0:51:06.44,0:51:10.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to change the way Washington works. And if we don't, our children are gonna be facing
Dialogue: 0,0:51:10.27,0:51:11.68,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the same problems we faced.
Dialogue: 0,0:51:11.68,0:51:15.17,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And our children's children will be facing the same problems they face." So, he made
Dialogue: 0,0:51:15.17,0:51:20.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,it--. He said twice at least, I have recorded in the campaign, "This is the reason I am
Dialogue: 0,0:51:20.55,0:51:26.81,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,running. To change the system." And then he got elected and he opened up the Clinton playbook.
Dialogue: 0,0:51:26.81,0:51:30.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And he ran his Administration according to the way Hilary Clinton would've run her Administration.
Dialogue: 0,0:51:30.55,0:51:33.64,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And I think maybe Clinton would have done a better job. I don't know. But if Clinton
Dialogue: 0,0:51:33.64,0:51:38.89,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,had done exactly what Barack Obama did, I think we should say, "Great. You did what
Dialogue: 0,0:51:38.89,0:51:43.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,would come from that kind of Administration. But you promised, Barack Obama, a different
Dialogue: 0,0:51:43.01,0:51:44.94,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Administration."
Dialogue: 0,0:51:44.94,0:51:50.47,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I feel it's a betrayal from what we thought we were getting. It makes it really hard for
Dialogue: 0,0:51:50.47,0:51:57.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,any of us to believe that reform is gonna come from the top or from any insider. So,
Dialogue: 0,0:51:57.56,0:52:03.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I think that this is why it becomes critical to think about these outside traditional politics
Dialogue: 0,0:52:03.37,0:52:08.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,solutions, which is unfortunately, I think, the only path we've got right now.
Dialogue: 0,0:52:08.54,0:52:13.23,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,He doesn't stand credible on this issue. The one person who is credible on this issue is--.
Dialogue: 0,0:52:13.23,0:52:19.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,I will vote for Obama over any Republican except one. The Republican you've not heard
Dialogue: 0,0:52:19.70,0:52:25.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of. His name is Buddy Roemer. Now, it's funny you haven't heard of him. I mean, he was a
Dialogue: 0,0:52:25.07,0:52:25.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,governor.
Dialogue: 0,0:52:25.07,0:52:29.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,He was a four-term Congressman. He ran a bank for 20 years without taking government bailouts
Dialogue: 0,0:52:29.14,0:52:35.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and successfully created this community bank. But he has made a pledge in his campaign for
Dialogue: 0,0:52:35.07,0:52:38.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the Republican nomination for President where he will take no more than a hundred dollars
Dialogue: 0,0:52:38.07,0:52:39.54,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,from anybody.
Dialogue: 0,0:52:39.54,0:52:44.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,He will commit to no PAC money, full disclosure, because he wants to as his slogan, "It's free
Dialogue: 0,0:52:44.40,0:52:47.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to lead." But because he takes no more than a hundred dollars, everybody says, "Well,
Dialogue: 0,0:52:47.42,0:52:50.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,you can't possibly win so, we're not even gonna pay attention to you." So, he hasn't
Dialogue: 0,0:52:50.90,0:52:55.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,even had a chance to make this case in the debate.
Dialogue: 0,0:52:55.14,0:52:59.69,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But if Buddy Roemer were the candidate in the Republican side, that would be a game-changer.
Dialogue: 0,0:52:59.69,0:53:03.91,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,If it were a Republican making this argument, then it would be much easier to imagine this
Dialogue: 0,0:53:03.91,0:53:05.53,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,argument actually having play.
Dialogue: 0,0:53:05.53,0:53:08.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #3: Thank you.
Dialogue: 0,0:53:08.10,0:53:14.98,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #4: Thank you for coming to talk to us today. I have a question about--. I think
Dialogue: 0,0:53:14.98,0:53:18.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,we all can understand that there's obviously a role that Congress has in perpetuating this
Dialogue: 0,0:53:18.78,0:53:22.67,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,system. And there's a role that we all have in our lack of action in perpetuating this
Dialogue: 0,0:53:22.67,0:53:23.18,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,system.
Dialogue: 0,0:53:23.18,0:53:25.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But I think one thing, you didn't get a chance to talk about and I don't know if you talk
Dialogue: 0,0:53:25.51,0:53:30.80,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,about it in your book--I look forward to reading it--is the role of the Supreme Court and notably
Dialogue: 0,0:53:30.80,0:53:33.84,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,one of your own bosses.
Dialogue: 0,0:53:33.84,0:53:38.100,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And how you talk about the people want to be more involved, but at this point, the Supreme
Dialogue: 0,0:53:38.100,0:53:46.56,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Court has defined "person" to be an incredibly broad system and how we can move away from
Dialogue: 0,0:53:46.56,0:53:51.04,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,treating corporations as people without their movement and how we can actually affect meaningful
Dialogue: 0,0:53:51.04,0:53:53.44,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,change without movement on the Supreme Court.
Dialogue: 0,0:53:53.44,0:53:57.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And a Supreme Court that seems very unlikely to move on that particular issue.
Dialogue: 0,0:53:57.38,0:54:01.57,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Yeah. So, the particular version of public funding that I advance is
Dialogue: 0,0:54:01.57,0:54:10.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,completely immune from Supreme Court invalidation. Nothing in the Supreme Court, even this Supreme
Dialogue: 0,0:54:10.07,0:54:13.14,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Court's doctrine, would draw this type of public funding into the out.
Dialogue: 0,0:54:13.14,0:54:20.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But it leaves the problem of independent expenditures, both of individuals, George Soros or the Koch
Dialogue: 0,0:54:20.15,0:54:25.07,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Brothers, as well as corporations, which now have unlimited amounts to spend. And it took
Dialogue: 0,0:54:25.07,0:54:29.88,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a comedian to teach the Supreme Court that, in fact, they didn't have to be disclosed
Dialogue: 0,0:54:29.88,0:54:33.40,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,if they all could be secret because you could channel them through a C4 that would itself
Dialogue: 0,0:54:33.40,0:54:37.24,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,be identified, but the contributors to the C4 not. OK.
Dialogue: 0,0:54:37.24,0:54:41.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, we have to address the problem of independent expenditures. Now, my view is the law should
Dialogue: 0,0:54:41.73,0:54:46.78,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,not ban anybody from saying anything. I think corporations should have a right to participate.
Dialogue: 0,0:54:46.78,0:54:52.65,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,But they shouldn't be able to dominate the political process so that we have not just
Dialogue: 0,0:54:52.65,0:54:58.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,shape-shifting to appeal to the funders, but we have shape-shifting to appeal to the independent
Dialogue: 0,0:54:58.15,0:55:03.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,expenditure guys and therefore, the same kind of dependency that corrupts the system.
Dialogue: 0,0:55:03.42,0:55:09.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, the only way to get there without imagining a Supreme Court reversing itself is to give
Dialogue: 0,0:55:09.59,0:55:14.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Congress the power to limit, but not to ban, independent expenditures. And if you're gonna
Dialogue: 0,0:55:14.39,0:55:18.59,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,change the Constitution from that standpoint, I say let's have an amendment that has three
Dialogue: 0,0:55:18.59,0:55:19.31,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,components.
Dialogue: 0,0:55:19.31,0:55:25.61,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Number one, public elections must be publicly funded. Number two, contributions to candidates
Dialogue: 0,0:55:25.61,0:55:31.73,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,should be capped. I'd say at a hundred dollars--equivalent of a hundred dollars. Number three, Congress
Dialogue: 0,0:55:31.73,0:55:36.49,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,has to have the power to limit, but not to ban, independent expenditures of both corporations
Dialogue: 0,0:55:36.49,0:55:37.28,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,and people.
Dialogue: 0,0:55:37.28,0:55:41.27,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,It just has to have the capacity to create a time for election that's not just about
Dialogue: 0,0:55:41.27,0:55:46.55,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,the money. But getting to the place that we can have the chance to have that amendment
Dialogue: 0,0:55:46.55,0:55:51.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,passed, is the hard thing because again, I looked it up, there's zero chance Congress
Dialogue: 0,0:55:51.90,0:55:53.10,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,is gonna propose such an amendment.
Dialogue: 0,0:55:53.10,0:55:57.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,And so, if Congress is not gonna propose the amendment, what's the path to get it at least
Dialogue: 0,0:55:57.15,0:55:58.66,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,on the table for states to adopt?
Dialogue: 0,0:55:58.66,0:56:00.42,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #4: Thank you very much.
Dialogue: 0,0:56:00.42,0:56:01.30,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Yup.
Dialogue: 0,0:56:01.30,0:56:07.01,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>FEMALE #1: Hi. I'm wondering about your perspective on venture philanthropy and the
Dialogue: 0,0:56:07.01,0:56:12.51,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,role of money outside the congressional system. Is it a pure good? I'm thinking, for example,
Dialogue: 0,0:56:12.51,0:56:16.26,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,of education reform, the Charter School movement, that sort of thing.
Dialogue: 0,0:56:16.26,0:56:20.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,Or, is there some danger there that money is talking more than it ought to, even in
Dialogue: 0,0:56:20.70,0:56:21.15,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,those worlds?
Dialogue: 0,0:56:21.15,0:56:26.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Yeah. It's a great question. I don't think you can say without reservations
Dialogue: 0,0:56:26.39,0:56:32.39,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that it's good. Although, you can say it's really great that it's out there, right? There
Dialogue: 0,0:56:32.39,0:56:41.02,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,are foundations that are not disciplined enough to insulate and protect the recipients from
Dialogue: 0,0:56:41.02,0:56:43.70,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,developing the wrong kind of dependency on the foundation.
Dialogue: 0,0:56:43.70,0:56:48.75,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,So, it distorts them in a way that I think is not productive. And so, harmful. But I
Dialogue: 0,0:56:48.75,0:56:55.90,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,think there are others that adopt a very appropriate relationship to the targets of their giving
Dialogue: 0,0:56:55.90,0:56:59.83,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,that allows them to maintain their independence, but does support their work. So, I think in
Dialogue: 0,0:56:59.83,0:57:04.46,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,a case-by-case way, we gotta make a decision about what's the appropriate kind of relationship
Dialogue: 0,0:57:04.46,0:57:05.74,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,to be drawing in that case.
Dialogue: 0,0:57:05.74,0:57:07.37,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>FEMALE #1: Thank you.
Dialogue: 0,0:57:07.37,0:57:12.19,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>MALE #5: So, we're out of time to take more questions, but thanks again for coming.
Dialogue: 0,0:57:12.19,0:57:13.38,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,>>Lawrence Lessig: Thank you. Thanks a lot.
Dialogue: 0,0:57:13.38,9:59:59.99,Default,,0000,0000,0000,,[applause]