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Cold Fusion, E-CAT - 2011, October 6th

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directed by Massimo Brega, Interviews by Raymond Zreick

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E-Cat, the water test: Bologna, 2011, October 6th.

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Andrea Rossi's E-Cat, a cold fusion device designed to produce plenty of cheap power

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is about to be tested again.

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THE WATER TEST - It must prove to be able to work in self substained mode and warm up running water.

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This is the most complete test they've had so far:

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will the scientist be satisfied?

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Andrea Rossi, E-Cat's father: "In the foregoing public tests

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we measured the output energy during the steam stage:

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it was more complicated, and generated discussions,

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pointless discussions, if you ask me.

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Today's measurement tecnique is much easier:

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the steam goes through a heat exchanger

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and warms up running water.

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The output energy is measured on this second water circuit, on liquid water.

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This make it easier to measure it."

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Do you think this is the best test Rossi ever arranged?

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Christos Stremmenos, physicist and chemist: "This test is clear, unmistakable

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with regards to the energy output.

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I mean thermic energy."

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Which results do you expect from this test?

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"An E-Cat such this one should produce around 3-4 kW of power."

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Is this test arranged for new potential business partners?

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"We have many potential business partners

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but this test is not for them.

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It is not a business oriented test.

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Our potential business partners are not here."

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TESTS IN THE U.S.A.?

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There have been rumors about you testing the E-Cat with the NASA...

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"No, I didn't. It's a blunder.

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We had many tests in the USA:

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Leonardo Corp. is based there

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which is the company that produces these devices.

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But we had no tests with the NASA.

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I met the NASA: we talked, we started up negotiations

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but no test."

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Where does the idea of the E-Cat come from?

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"I designed the device.

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Professor Focardi provided very important advice

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with regard to nuclear physics

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but the device is designed and produced by Leonardo Corp.

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I invented it."

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How far is the E-Cat from Sergio Focardi's works?

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Sergio Focardi, physicist: "Quite far.

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First of all, my works were quite rough

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my devices were hand made in a University context

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nobody ever funded my research because

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in everybody's opinion that phenomenon didn't exist."

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What do the E-Cat and Focardi's work have in common?

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"They both work with hydrogen and nickel

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these are the main ingredients.

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Here there is some kind of additive that enhances the reaction

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we didn't have that, and we also didn't know the reaction that well."

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Will the E-Cat be able to draw the scientific world's attention?

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"Yes, and that's why:

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the E-Cat works thanks to a nuclear fusion phenomenon

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between nickel and hydrogen

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at low temperature, not higher that a few hundreds degrees [Celsius].

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It's a nuclear neaction.

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Well, the scientific world thinks that nuclear reactions [such this one]

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only happen inside the stars."

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What is the scientific world's attitude?

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"Many colleagues still don't believe in our results

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because they think it's impossible!

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But their attitude is incredible, it goes against science.

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Science teaches that if you prove something, then it's true."

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What is the reason of such distrust?

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Mats Lewan, journalist (NyTeknik): "If this works, it's going to need a new physics.

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The core of this reactor is of the size of a potato:

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not big enough to hold fuel inside itself

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and produce heat thanks to a chemical reaction. It must be a nuclear reaction,

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'cause only a nuclear reaction can produce so much power in such a small room.

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Nuclear reaction are a million times more powerfull then chemical ones,

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per atom, per mass.

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And we don't know any nuclear reaction that produces this kind of power in this way

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therefore it will need a new physics."

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What can we expect from this kind of technology?

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"It could help finding the solutions to many problems

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energy problems, but other fields might also be involved.

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In general terms, when a new technology is born

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we know, by experience, that it's almost impossible to imagine

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the consequences it might generate.

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We're almost never able to imagine the final results it might lead to.

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Take the laser, for instance: who would have imagined

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it would bring to dvd players?

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Nobody, and that's just an example.

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Who invented the phonograph didn't think of music business.

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It's hard to tell what it might lead to in the long run.

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In the short run, it produces heat

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and with heat you can warm up buildings, for instance, or even cool them.

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With heat you can produce air conditioning.

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And, very important, you can boil water, and desalinate sea water

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producing clean water all over the world.

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This would be a revolution itself."

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The E-Cat would be a revolution. Did anybody tried to meddle or stop you?

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"Well, yes, this technology could lead to consequences both important and complicated.

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Someone tried to interfere, but it wasn't a big problem, and it didn't stop us from going on with our operations."

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At the end of the test, the "secret ingredient" is still a mistery...

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"The black box where the heating reaction takes place

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it should be about the size of a potato:

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50 cm3.

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We can't look inside it."

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Why do you need to use electric power at the beginning of the test?

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It warms a resistance up

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and the resistance warms up the reactor, it triggers the reaction.

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If i got it right, the reaction begins

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when the reactor reaches a temperature of about 60°

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something like that.

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With this setup, the electric power is fed to the device for a long time

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to make the reaction stable

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so that later we can switch the electric power off."

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What does it mean that the E-Cat works in self substained mode?

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"At first, Rossi switches the electric power off for about 10 minutes.

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Then he swithces it on, and after a while he switches it off again.

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He keeps on switching it off and on for a while,

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it seems that this is necessary to make the reaction stable.

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Then he switches it completely off, except fot the power that feeds the control console

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which uses about 100 W, not more than a light bulb does.

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It's been working in self substained mode for a couple of hours now."

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Mats Lewan thought that Rossi should have had the test running on till late night...

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Instead, he shut the E-Cat down around 19:30

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"I hope the E-Cat will be working in self substained mode for at least two more hours

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we could shut it down around 22, 23, even midnight.

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After that, we'd still have to wait [before we can open it]:

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to end the reaction, you have to take the hydrogen off the reactor

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but it will still produce heat for a while even so."

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Mats Lewan noted down all measurements on his notepad.

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How is the test going?

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"If we can trust the measures we see,

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we have a certain water flow rate,

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a centain delta T between the input and output water.

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If the numbers are corrects

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the output power is around 4-5 kW.

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Watt measure power. Energy is how much is piled up during a certaind amount of time.

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Input power (electric power) was around 2,5 kW:

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half the output power.

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In theory, one could say that the E-Cat stores

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the electric power you feed it in the beginning

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to use it later.

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But if it works in self substained mode for many hours,

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that is not an option anymore."

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Are you satisfied with the results? Did everything go as you expected?

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"Today's test went well, i'm satisfied enough

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even if I saw a few imperfections I'll have to fix."

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Did these imperfections affect the results?

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"No. Engeneering reached its final stages.

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No, we know it works,

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we were already sure it worked, when we took the measurements from the steam.

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We know what we're doing. I think we are on the right path."

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What about tomorrow?

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"The next step is the start up of this 1 MW plant we're in right now."

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E-Cat succesful or not?

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The scientists who were at the test are satisfied:

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The E-Cat worked on self substained mode for 3 hours and a half

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and the first numbers confirm it can produce power by itself.

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Nevertheless most of the scientific world is still sceptical about the results

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and has doubts about the reliability and the setup of the test.

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Andrea Rossi answers these critiques on Focus.it:

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"I won't give any other demonstration.

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I'm going to hit the market, our customers will speak for us!"

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All the updates on E-Cat, Andrea Rossi and cold fusion on www.focus.it

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subs by Irene Zreick