0:00:23.139,0:00:27.568 We are two "MJC" (NT: an organism which promotes culture among young people) to welcome you tonight: the Saint-Just MJC, where you currently are 0:00:27.568,0:00:32.315 and the Ménival MJC. We worked together on some debates because this is an important year 0:00:32.315,0:00:36.027 politically speaking, as you know, and one of our calling 0:00:36.027,0:00:38.277 is to work on this, especially with young people, 0:00:38.277,0:00:42.551 and try to initiate them... So we organize citizen debates. 0:00:42.551,0:00:46.769 So there is a first debate tonight. We wanted to shake things up. 0:00:46.769,0:00:50.783 It is, I think, the purpose of MJC's, to compel people 0:00:50.783,0:00:56.916 to think out of the box; a place that tries to bring new ideas, 0:00:56.916,0:01:01.699 Our funders don't really like it but we don't care. 0:01:01.699,0:01:05.999 I won't say more. Just know that we really enjoy debates here, 0:01:05.999,0:01:11.066 more and more, and I have said to many: "you are glad to be here, 0:01:11.066,0:01:13.948 but if you want to help prepare other debates, 0:01:13.948,0:01:18.257 you are welcome. Have a good night !" - Thanks 0:01:20.288,0:01:25.865 Hi ! Good evening to all of you. 0:01:25.865,0:01:40.946 So I... You must know that... I'm currently on a pioneering work about the mess we are in 0:01:40.946,0:01:49.163 and I feel like I have found, working with you, 0:01:49.163,0:01:55.847 it is a collective work, 0:01:55.847,0:02:04.113 some kind of antidote to olligarchy... and I would like to 0:02:04.113,0:02:07.318 present it to you, but not too long 0:02:07.318,0:02:14.447 in order to leave room for your objections, because this is then 0:02:14.447,0:02:21.064 that we progress the most. The inconvenient 0:02:21.064,0:02:26.497 is that when someone join the project without knowing anything about it 0:02:26.497,0:02:30.968 there will be a lack of informations, [br]but there's more and more stuff 0:02:30.968,0:02:34.250 on the web, a lot of videos and texts 0:02:34.250,0:02:38.180 to come again and rework it. 0:02:38.180,0:02:47.054 Anyway, the topic is democracy...[br]true democracy 0:02:47.054,0:02:50.215 It requires everyone to work. 0:02:50.215,0:02:53.890 It is not enough to listen some guy only once 0:02:53.890,0:02:58.863 with ideas... "well, well, interesting." 0:02:58.863,0:03:04.303 The idea, to make things work well, [br]is that we appropriate 0:03:04.303,0:03:08.662 the subjects I will talk to you about tonight,[br]and to do so 0:03:08.662,0:03:10.658 I think it requires work, that is to say 0:03:10.658,0:03:13.324 read a little, and try by yourselves 0:03:13.324,0:03:15.658 to explain to others, and when you're gonna[br]explain to others, 0:03:15.658,0:03:18.509 they will have objections, 0:03:18.509,0:03:20.358 and at first objections will unseat you; 0:03:20.358,0:03:26.323 and then, you have to work, [br]and you will become... 0:03:26.323,0:03:29.254 I was gonna say invulnerable,[br]not exactly, but... 0:03:29.254,0:03:35.323 You will see that the objections[br]- I will tell you which in a moment - 0:03:35.323,0:03:37.054 I don't think it resist analysis 0:03:37.054,0:03:41.820 But maybe tonight you will find[br]new objections 0:03:41.820,0:03:45.921 and put me in trouble. 0:03:45.921,0:03:56.124 So, maybe two words to present myself.[br]I am a teacher in Marseille, France. 0:03:56.124,0:04:02.545 Six years ago, back in 2004-2005,[br]I was still an elector, 0:04:02.545,0:04:08.884 a simple elector, asleep, passive, 0:04:08.884,0:04:17.987 unworried. I voted. I saw [br]it wasn't changing anything, 0:04:17.987,0:04:21.737 but it didn't bother me, I was minding[br]my small business, like everybody. 0:04:21.737,0:04:26.403 And in 2005, on the occasion of a debate[br]about a referendum, 0:04:26.403,0:04:31.330 you have to remember this, the debate about[br]the european anti-constitution... 0:04:31.330,0:04:33.474 Don't forget to say "anti-constitution", 0:04:33.474,0:04:41.173 because they called it constitution 0:04:41.173,0:04:45.690 but in fact european treaties are meant to destroy 0:04:45.690,0:04:49.723 constitutions. They don't do what they were created for.[br]We're gonna talk about it later, 0:04:49.723,0:04:51.810 I'm gonna elaborate a bit; there isn't enough [br]time tonight 0:04:51.810,0:04:56.506 to talk about european institutions; it is another matter... 0:04:56.506,0:05:03.357 It would require an entire evening, [br]so I will just raise it. 0:05:03.357,0:05:08.323 Anyway, it is on this occasion that I woke up[br]in 2005 0:05:08.323,0:05:12.394 I realized it was something very dangerous. 0:05:12.394,0:05:18.180 "What is this thing ?!". And on the occasion of the debates,[br]something extraordinary happened to me. 0:05:18.180,0:05:21.441 I wrote a text, put it online, 0:05:21.441,0:05:23.812 a lot of people were doing it. 0:05:23.812,0:05:27.809 The text started to circulate, more and more, 0:05:27.809,0:05:33.732 and I ended up receiving hundred of mails per day, 0:05:33.732,0:05:38.434 very moving, touching, [br]enthusiastic mails, 0:05:38.434,0:05:41.263 very happy mails, those who wrote it[br]were happy 0:05:41.263,0:05:44.636 to have found, at last,[br]a clear way of saying 0:05:44.636,0:05:47.801 what they couldn't formulate; 0:05:47.801,0:05:50.646 really a lot of happy,[br]very enthusiastic mails, 0:05:50.646,0:05:54.203 that gave me a lot of energy. 0:05:54.203,0:06:01.623 And then hundreds a day, for two months[br]I received 12000 mails ! 0:06:01.623,0:06:03.396 A lot more than I could handle, 0:06:03.396,0:06:06.339 but I spent entire nights to answer[br]to these people. 0:06:06.339,0:06:07.788 And among them there were people who[br]didn't like me at all, 0:06:07.788,0:06:14.453 who thought i was an impostor, a liar... 0:06:14.453,0:06:16.828 Some said I was a "trotskist submarin",[br]some said 0:06:16.828,0:06:20.764 "a far right submarin", [br]well, a submarin, right. 0:06:20.764,0:06:23.567 But these people were hurting me,[br]because I was just like everybody, 0:06:23.567,0:06:26.181 I wasn't armed for that, 0:06:26.181,0:06:28.615 it just happened. And I tell you about this 0:06:28.615,0:06:30.416 because later, when we will talk about[br]intitutions 0:06:30.601,0:06:34.804 you will see the athenians used [br]what has allowed me to improve. 0:06:34.804,0:06:39.443 What has made me change is the look [br]of others upon me 0:06:39.443,0:06:41.336 the benevolent look of others[br]that was saying: 0:06:41.336,0:06:46.903 "Yes ! Keep up like that !"[br]Humans are sensitive to that 0:06:46.903,0:06:52.820 - and me too obviously - and the suspicious, [br]malicious look 0:06:52.820,0:06:57.659 of others, it motivates too, it's like [br]the carrot and the stick. 0:06:57.659,0:06:59.860 "Why does he say I'm a liar, an impostor, 0:06:59.860,0:07:02.507 why does he say I know nothing,[br]I will prove him wrong." 0:07:02.507,0:07:04.456 And this is a motivation too. 0:07:04.456,0:07:07.908 So with both motivations, I have started[br]to work like a madman, 0:07:07.908,0:07:13.506 and six years later I still haven't stopped.[br]So I have started reading a lot. 0:07:13.506,0:07:18.573 So about what intellectual mechanism, to what avail ? 0:07:18.573,0:07:21.222 I started with with one finding and I'll try to pick up 0:07:21.222,0:07:25.461 the logical thread that led to my conclusions 0:07:25.461,0:07:29.666 to see if you end up on the same conclusions. So that you might be able to tell me: 0:07:29.666,0:07:33.424 "Hang on, there's something here that's not making sense, that doesn't fit in correctly..." 0:07:33.424,0:07:38.147 I'm counting on you to stop me if you feel that I'm saying something foolish or just wrong. 0:07:38.147,0:07:41.665 Feel free to interrupt, by all means. It will be slightly more disorderly 0:07:41.665,0:07:45.758 but it'll be more alive. If you need to stop me, it doesn't bother me. 0:07:45.758,0:07:56.377 So I started with... At the end of the debate on the treaty (NT: establishing a Constitution for Europe), we voted No 0:07:56.377,0:07:58.997 on May 29th 2005, a date we should remember. 0:07:58.997,0:08:01.710 It's an important moment where we succeded in saying "No" in France, 0:08:01.710,0:08:06.809 when all the media, the newspapers, the TV show were pushing us to say "Yes", 0:08:06.809,0:08:12.710 or we'd be xenophobic, racists and so on. 0:08:12.710,0:08:16.226 We were... At least all the people who were saying "No" were ill treated by the media. 0:08:16.226,0:08:19.165 And despite that, we succeded in saying "No" because we actually talked a lot about it between us 0:08:19.165,0:08:24.110 and in the details (NT: of the treaty), there were real and solid reasons to say "No". 0:08:24.110,0:08:33.548 And so we, French, say "No" and comes the summer. Shall we work on something else? What do we do? 0:08:33.548,0:08:38.332 What people wrote to me drove me to carry on. 0:08:38.332,0:08:39.965 To carry on, because we had said "No", we had opposed the treaty, 0:08:39.965,0:08:42.349 and that it's easier to be an opposition than to actually build something. 0:08:42.349,0:08:45.483 And so I started imagining... If it doesn't seem right, 0:08:45.483,0:08:49.550 if that Constitution wasn't good, and I could well see that the Constitution of 1958, 0:08:49.550,0:08:52.416 ours, of the 5th French Republic, was almost as bad. 0:08:52.416,0:08:58.153 "As bad", I can say that, the french canadians use it... 0:08:58.153,0:09:02.316 The Constitution of 1958 is almost as horrible 0:09:02.316,0:09:04.733 than the European Constitution, just slightly less. 0:09:04.733,0:09:10.866 So if these Constitutions are so wrong... I asked myself the following question: 0:09:10.866,0:09:13.645 "Why was it written so badly?" And so my text 0:09:13.645,0:09:20.427 that had been read by many, in my fifth argument, I came to this important conclusion: 0:09:20.427,0:09:24.126 I beleive that if this European text was so bad 0:09:24.126,0:09:30.476 it's because those writting it should never have written it. 0:09:30.476,0:09:32.910 I think that if the European Institutions are so bad 0:09:32.910,0:09:37.143 it's because the people who wrote them were ministers (NT: Secretaries of State) 0:09:37.143,0:09:40.376 and that those ministers, we'll bring it up later on, 0:09:40.376,0:09:42.060 when they are writing a Constitution, 0:09:42.060,0:09:45.777 they are writing the rules that they should be fearing. 0:09:45.777,0:09:48.028 Because the role of a Constitution is to weaken the influence of Power. 0:09:48.028,0:09:51.812 It's to put fear in those who have Power. A Constitution is used to protect us 0:09:51.812,0:09:58.294 against abuse of power. I have practiced law so that's what I learned in law school. 0:09:58.294,0:10:02.543 Well...leanred... In truth, we don't exactly learn that in law. 0:10:02.543,0:10:06.198 We learn that a Constitution serves the purpose of organising powers, 0:10:06.198,0:10:09.861 to seperate powers, to protect. OK. We talk a bit about it, 0:10:09.861,0:10:12.695 but we don't linger on the subject. We have many things to see 0:10:12.695,0:10:15.543 in Constitutional Law and in my opinion, we don't talk about this enough. 0:10:15.543,0:10:18.671 We should learn in kindergarten, then in primary school, 0:10:18.671,0:10:20.843 bash it in us, then in middle school and in high school, 0:10:20.843,0:10:26.727 and then our whole life, we should learn this essential point, 0:10:26.727,0:10:31.377 which is probably one of the most important mechanisms 0:10:31.377,0:10:33.393 of what I will tell you tonight: 0:10:33.393,0:10:35.520 "What is, really, a Constitution? What is its' purpose?" 0:10:35.520,0:10:41.325 A Constitution is a superior text. We are at the bottom, 0:10:41.325,0:10:45.962 we are base level citizens, the atoms of the social body, 0:10:45.962,0:10:51.011 and we need to be able to organise ourselves, to pacify us, 0:10:51.011,0:10:54.277 to not fight amongst one another, we need 0:10:54.277,0:10:59.661 written rules that let us solve disputes 0:10:59.661,0:11:03.460 and that give us a reason not to fight. These rules are written 0:11:03.460,0:11:07.335 by people that we place above us, a lawmaker for example, 0:11:07.459,0:11:10.478 or the executive who will execute laws with the help of police, armed forces, 0:11:10.478,0:11:13.493 judges. So these powers that are going to apply this law, 0:11:13.493,0:11:18.593 so these common rules, who pacify us, the people who produce or 0:11:18.593,0:11:22.457 who apply this law; we accept, we, at the bottom, 0:11:22.457,0:11:26.440 we accept to have them above us, because it pacifies us. 0:11:26.440,0:11:28.841 OK. Everyone gets it, I won't go further. 0:11:28.841,0:11:35.058 The fact is, through law, we are less brutal. 0:11:35.058,0:11:40.874 But the powers who will be... Alright, we are millions, but even if wh'n we're just thousands, 0:11:40.874,0:11:43.859 or tens' of thousands, we cannot writ law ourselves. 0:11:43.859,0:11:47.207 We're just too many. So we need to delegate to some people the job to write this law. 0:11:47.207,0:11:50.697 So we need representatives to help us build, 0:11:50.697,0:11:54.188 and to set in place the law to which we will submit. 0:11:54.188,0:11:58.372 But these actors who are going to producte this law, 0:11:58.372,0:12:02.030 they are at the same time very useful, but also very dangerous. 0:12:02.030,0:12:05.024 If they respect the greater good (common interest), all is well. 0:12:05.024,0:12:06.443 But if they don't respect the greater good, 0:12:06.443,0:12:12.282 if they start to pursue personal gain, or the interest of a group, 0:12:12.282,0:12:16.599 of a cast, of a social class, or a party of citizens, 0:12:16.599,0:12:20.229 at that moment, all citizens are in danger of being abused by power. 0:12:20.229,0:12:25.523 So this we know from start. Eve in Athens, at the time, they had a Constitution. 0:12:25.523,0:12:30.721 The Constitution is a text that is above people, 0:12:30.721,0:12:34.748 above these (political) actors, above parlement, above government, 0:12:34.748,0:12:37.717 above judges but it must also be above media, 0:12:37.717,0:12:41.829 of banks... All those who have power. 0:12:41.829,0:12:45.211 Above that, we put a superior text called the Constitution, 0:12:45.211,0:12:47.613 which isn't a dusty old text 0:12:47.613,0:12:51.356 which we don't care about. It's a central text that we should know by heart, 0:12:51.356,0:12:55.822 that we should defend. We should know 0:12:55.822,0:12:59.256 all the mechanisms of the Constitution to know what it's this is used for, what that is used for, 0:12:59.256,0:13:01.290 this part is a good one, that one doesn't look good but in truth 0:13:01.290,0:13:05.656 it's to balance that other one. We should know the mechanism 0:13:05.656,0:13:07.506 - which shouldn't be too complicated because it needs to be in the reach of 0:13:07.506,0:13:09.739 all to grasp - we should know the mechanism 0:13:09.739,0:13:12.657 of a Constitution because it is above people who are in power 0:13:12.657,0:13:15.420 to protect us, to protect, us, of abuse of power. 0:13:15.420,0:13:18.315 Do you get it ? It's really important. 0:13:18.315,0:13:28.965 The Constitution shouldn't be a formality. Not at all, really. 0:13:28.965,0:13:35.494 So, I had this in mind. I knew what a Constitution was for, 0:13:35.494,0:13:37.744 and I had argued against for two, three months, 0:13:37.744,0:13:40.227 against this European Constitution that wasn't doing its' job. 0:13:40.227,0:13:43.860 It doesn't protect us and it doesn't protect us because it was written by people 0:13:43.860,0:13:48.360 who have are interested in our impotency. 0:13:48.360,0:13:52.644 So that was about the time that I started to tell myself: 0:13:52.644,0:14:00.593 "Right, what do we put instead of this one ? What should be in an actual good Constitution ?" 0:14:00.593,0:14:04.827 So I wrote a text, that was a starting point of a whole serie, 0:14:04.827,0:14:09.228 I wrote a text that was called "The great principles of a good Constitution". 0:14:09.228,0:14:12.461 So I worked on it for the whole summer, a few months, 0:14:12.461,0:14:16.045 and I published it. But that's when I noticed I didn't have the interaction anymore 0:14:16.045,0:14:22.161 with all those people I had during those 2-3 months. 0:14:22.161,0:14:26.561 I discovered during those first 2-3 months of interaction, of referendum debate, 0:14:26.561,0:14:30.518 that we never move forward as well as during a contradicting debate. 0:14:30.518,0:14:32.540 When we are between us... Tonight, there's a good chance that 0:14:32.540,0:14:38.602 we'll agree. So we probably won't progress as much as 0:14:38.602,0:14:42.925 if we had amongst us people who don't agree at all! 0:14:42.925,0:14:45.078 Even people we really don't like at all. 0:14:45.078,0:14:49.113 So it's less pleasant. Here, it'll be pleasant if we all agree, 0:14:49.113,0:14:51.361 but we must understand that we'll progress less. 0:14:51.361,0:14:55.978 I'd even go as far as to say that we'll enclose ourselves in misleading directions without realising 0:14:55.978,0:15:01.162 that it is a wrong direction, because we didn't have the conflincting arguments. 0:15:01.162,0:15:04.496 That is putting in the correct light all the ins 0:15:04.496,0:15:06.812 and outs of a subject, which is precisely 0:15:06.812,0:15:10.995 what a real democracy tries to set up. We'll talk about it later on. 0:15:10.995,0:15:17.013 So I missed having that interaction so, in january 2006, I create my website. 0:15:17.013,0:15:20.312 It's really my work tool... I don't write books, 0:15:20.312,0:15:22.979 but I have enormously written with you, I have quite a lot 0:15:22.979,0:15:28.362 on that website. So it has become interactive in 2006 0:15:28.362,0:15:33.930 with a forum to have discussion, argument by argument, of this text: 0:15:33.930,0:15:36.128 "The great principles of a good Democracy". 0:15:36.128,0:15:39.046 So I put: "The blank ballot must be respected." 0:15:39.046,0:15:42.995 So "The blank ballot must be respected," it's a starting point for a discussion with you. 0:15:42.995,0:15:47.961 I say "you" in the generical sens, with the others. 0:15:47.961,0:15:51.680 And so it's a starting point of the conversation and there was 0:15:51.680,0:15:54.446 hundreds of pages on the blank ballot, very detailled 0:15:54.446,0:15:58.229 explaining why we need the blank ballot, 0:15:58.229,0:16:01.795 and how we would make it work if we were the ones writing the Constitution, 0:16:01.795,0:16:07.762 what would we write for articles? So we had about 20 items, 0:16:07.762,0:16:10.396 20 points that were grand principles that were in my document. 0:16:10.396,0:16:14.379 But after that, it was "open" because you could, you still can, 0:16:14.379,0:16:20.847 create new discussions, new threads of comments on the institutions. 0:16:20.847,0:16:25.213 So, for example, in 2006, quite rapidly 0:16:25.213,0:16:27.979 came André-Jacques Holbecq who became a friend 0:16:27.979,0:16:32.431 and who created a thread on the forum: "In the Constitution, 0:16:32.431,0:16:35.278 we should take back the power over money." (NT: creation of money) 0:16:35.278,0:16:41.579 It became one of the main threads. There must around 200 discussion threads on the forum. 0:16:41.579,0:16:45.796 It's quite a large object but you must take it thread by thread and... 0:16:45.796,0:16:48.442 Alright, it's a lot of work to keep us busy, but it's exciting. 0:16:48.442,0:16:52.456 On every thread, we talk about the things that concern you. 0:16:52.456,0:16:56.206 We talk about our concerns. We talk about things that interest us a lot more than soccer 0:16:56.206,0:16:57.858 or rugby. I mean... 0:16:57.858,0:17:02.308 ... that are much more able to change our life, 0:17:02.308,0:17:08.725 in a comfortable and mutual respectful sens, by taking pleasure in taking care of common affairs 0:17:08.725,0:17:12.123 rather than imposed subjects that hear about in the medias. 0:17:12.123,0:17:17.140 So it's large, but it's interesting. 0:17:17.140,0:17:21.490 On this forum, we have conversation themes 0:17:21.490,0:17:24.776 where we discuss directly the aspects of the Constitution. 0:17:24.776,0:17:28.490 And in a second part, we have a "Wiki". 0:17:28.490,0:17:32.256 It's another technology, the Wiki, you can all write on it, 0:17:32.256,0:17:39.557 and it's a part reserved to the Constitution. The difference is that here we have articles. 0:17:39.557,0:17:42.373 It's a place where we can really write the Constitution. 0:17:42.373,0:17:45.923 We write those articles. So first, we debate on the forum, 0:17:45.923,0:17:49.058 point by point, and when we're sure: "There, we've done it, 0:17:49.058,0:17:52.141 we understood what we want in a citizen initiated referendum, 0:17:52.141,0:17:54.307 we understood what we want on judges' responsability, 0:17:54.307,0:17:56.290 we understood what we want on seperation of power, 0:17:56.290,0:17:58.558 we understood what we want on journalists: what are we going to do for journalists 0:17:58.558,0:18:01.406 what do we plan in the Constitution concerning journalists." 0:18:01.406,0:18:05.423 On the forum, we set down what we wanted and then on the Wiki 0:18:05.423,0:18:09.690 we write the articles. So there's a common base, 0:18:09.690,0:18:15.824 there is a shared Constitution on the Wiki that is the result 0:18:15.824,0:18:18.740 of almost all that we've said. It's a synthesis. 0:18:18.740,0:18:21.956 And then, there are parts where you can create your own page. 0:18:21.956,0:18:24.606 When you create an account on the Wiki, you can write your own page. 0:18:24.606,0:18:27.641 At start with just a couple articles, but these articles 0:18:27.641,0:18:29.641 that seem the most important for you and then it grows 0:18:29.641,0:18:33.356 as you add your elements. When you signal to me that it's has become something 0:18:33.356,0:18:36.807 where you are in need for confrontation 0:18:36.807,0:18:41.823 with the opinion of others to progress, I add a link to your page 0:18:41.823,0:18:43.956 on the left hand menu. You'll see in the menu on the left 0:18:43.956,0:18:46.790 that there are some Constitutions of guys who have put a lot of effort 0:18:46.790,0:18:50.975 to think on projects that are sincerly interesting. 0:18:50.975,0:18:54.390 The forum and the Wiki are interactive objects. Start to think on it. 0:18:54.390,0:18:58.131 And then there is a third part which is a blog. 0:18:58.131,0:19:00.115 This is a technology you probably already know about 0:19:00.115,0:19:04.764 since there are many on Internet. This blog is dedicated to everything that is related to the subject 0:19:04.764,0:19:08.726 but isn't really in the Constitution directly but that is linked. For example: Economy. 0:19:08.726,0:19:13.208 There are many important things, many important subjects on economy, 0:19:13.208,0:19:18.692 in philosophy, in sociology, in history. So points that aren't specificly institutional, 0:19:18.692,0:19:21.576 but still very interesting to understand reality, 0:19:21.576,0:19:24.674 powers in place and abuse of power. Concerning power and abuse of power, 0:19:24.674,0:19:28.674 I talk about it on the blog, for example. So, the history of power, the history of abuse of power, 0:19:28.674,0:19:33.758 of resistance against abuse of power and all that goes inside the blog. So to be short! 0:19:33.758,0:19:40.275 Actually...I keep saying that I'll be brief but I'm just incapable of keeping it short... 0:19:40.275,0:19:47.042 I need to go quicker. I have built this tool that let's us, together, 0:19:47.042,0:19:52.275 think correctly about what should go in the Constitution, 0:19:52.275,0:19:57.741 what are the weaknesses of the current Constitutions. 0:19:57.741,0:19:59.757 It's not all about saying: 0:19:59.757,0:20:03.679 "The Constitution is bad, we want a good one". Here, we're writing it !